i just toyed around with it a bit, i only have one suggestion for you which comes from max and i find it very usefull:

while you do something like moving verts or alike, you can rightclick and the transformation is resetted and canceled.

so, its like an instant undo...
i thought u might be interested in adding such a feature...

keep it up, nice work, very impressive!

also, on my win 7 64 Bit the splash screen wasnt transparent, but green in the background!

xXm0RpH3usXx: It sounds a good idea, I will give it a shot. Thanks!

Hi Guys,

Just a small update.

http://www.digitalfossils.com/Downlo...rld-Nov-16.rar
Summary of changes
* Right click to cancel on going modify action like transforming/extrude/etc. Some operations use RMB, in this case, hit the Action Cancel hotkey (Esc) instead.
* Hit Enter key to create primitives at cusor snapping point.

Thanks!

I'm really starting to love this tool so thanks for making it available.
It's great that you listen and implement suggestions here; you don't get that with Autodesk so it's very much appreciated.

A bit of feedback from Nov 16th release.

It all feels a bit more fluid in the navigation, snapping and tweaking. Thanks for releasing the Customize Tools from locking down VoidWorld; it's a small thing but already it feels a lot nicer to use. Was it a lot of work as I noticed a few of the other menus still lock VW down?

• Primitive placement - MMB or pressing Q to auto complete Primitive placement would be desirable.
• Primitive placement - to draw a primitive on objects based on the normal under the cursor.
• Tweak doesn't work with splines (tweak should work consistently across the whole app I think)
• Tweak should also work at the Object level. (for easy Move/Rotate in screen space/Scale of Objects) This will keep things consistent.
• Switch edge colour - reverts back to white everytime app is started
• Normal Move tool - Give option for users to change default movement of UP/DOWN to LEFT/RIGHT or both for the operation of this tool. This might be small thing but can lead to loss of flow with different methods between applications.
• Normal Move tool - Is it possible to toggle on Multi selection whenever the hotkey is pressed? (I have Multi selection activate whenever I use the Tweak tool) Actually it'd be preferrable if there were options for all modes.
• Loop select/slide Edges 'G' still selects and slides edges on key press resulting in undesirable movement of geometry. Desired result would be to operate on LMB.
• Is it possible to turn off cycling through the different selection marquees every time Q is pressed. I tend to work with rectangle selection type every time and occasionally switch to others in specific circumstances). I have accidentally pressed Q multiple times and received the wrong selection marquee.

Thanks

I have been doing a lot of hardsurface mechanical modelling lately and I have a question about your thoughts on the future of this app. The toolset that you have in seems to be pretty solid but I'd love to see some more ways to manipulate/control the topology. Have you guys heard of/used Polyboost for max? It has some brilliant ideas that I think VW could really benefit from implementing. e.g
http://www.polyboost.com/Images/Gifs/CurveLoop.gif
&
http://www.polyboost.com/Images/Gifs/SpaceLoop.gif

Thanks again for all the hard work.

Just something small I found, VW does not seem to save changes to poly groups when saving to an OBJ.

I also want to echo my appreciation for this tool. The more I use VW the more I'm impressed with the ease of use so far.

ghib: When you notice any menus that need not to lock main app, please note them down and give me the list so I can fix them. It is difficult for me to check every menu since I am not fimiliar with workflow. As for the Polyboost you mentioned, I heard it before but never used it. I am not sure what's the difference between curveloop and spaceloop, they look the same to me, can you elaborate?

GrepD3: I will add a couple more .obj export/import options so you can have more control over the polygon grouping.

I found a glitch in normal move.. and also orientation

Isn't the pivot in these selection should be like the one in bottom left?



Played around with orientation and pivot position, couldnt get desired result.

also the normal move seems to move with undesired result, shouldn't it be parallel to the normal?



in maya its set to normal average mode.

I agree with Ghib regarding marquee selection. Honestly we only need rectangle marquee and lasso, that's all we used daily.

How bout q for rectangular marquee selection, hold q and move cursor for lasso?

Hey e|te, I noticed this too when I 1st tried the normal move but I couldn't reproduce it so I didn't write the bug.

RE: curve loop/ space loop discussion. Here is my understanding of it; but I could be wrong.

The Space loop would keep the existing shape continuity but space the selected geometry evenly. I demonstrated this at the top with a circular example but the shape could be anything. I think the important thing here is to keep the existing shape but space things evenly.

The Curve loop would create an imaginary smooth curve between the selected points and place the geometry on it but keep the existing spacing.

I hope this helps explain. I'm a little bit fuzzy on the science behind it myself.

Also a spherize function on selected Geometry would be very handy.


p.s. I like the idea of holding q and move to quickly change selection methods.

Is there a way to select shells in VW? I can't seem to find a way.

In silo it's a simple procedure by double clicking on a shell in poly mode.
You can see here that the geometry is part of the same object but the teeth and eyes are separate disconnected shells. Silo will recognise this lack of connected geometry and the selection grow will continue until it is terminated.



*edit*
typical. As soon as I posted this I found the Grow Select function. My apologies. Actually it would still be nice to be able to double click on a single poly and have it activate 'full grow'

On the same concept of double clicking geometry it would speed things up if we could double click to select edge-rings/loops, partial & gap-loop.

So in this case single select 1st component, double click 2nd component.
To select full edge ring you would single select 1st edge & double click the immediately adjacent edge.

heh ghib your ring and loop select method has been proposed waaaaaaaay early in this thread, but now with your timelapse it will be much better understood. right now full loop is double click lmb, while full ring is double click mmb

Originally Posted by elte

while full ring is double click mmb

Dagnabbit how did I not notice that, it's the exact same in Silo. thanks for the tip.

btw it's not timelapse; I'm just that fast

Originally Posted by elte

heh ghib your ring and loop select method has been proposed waaaaaaaay early in this thread, but now with your timelapse it will be much better understood. right now full loop is double click lmb, while full ring is double click mmb

Just to clarify how that partial loop/ring works in silo - you are still using the double click functionality to select those loops, you just double click on the edge that you want the loop to terminate at. It's not a separate function requiring more keybinds like you see in other apps.

There should probably still be keyboard shortcuts for "select ring" and "select loop. " For example, I will select a horizontal edge, select one up the model from it a bit, call "select ring" to select all edges between them that are part of the same ring, then call "select loop."

A friend of mine had crash on this operation, so I reproduced it.

Here's a few thing that hurt the workflow imho:

-cut tool should split an edge in two (adding a vert in the middle) when only on edge is selected, and this should be applicable multiple time on an edge.
-edge ring should merge full ring and range ring into on function:
*When one edge is selected, on activation the tool should select the whole ring.
*When two edges (or more) are selected, the vw should find the shortest path between them and add the gaps to selection.

In silo it is done by shift double clicking the ending edge, and it's damn useful, the interactive way of doing it in vw is visualy confusing and error prone.

-Same goes for edge loop.
-This should also work for polygons.


+ In customization windows:
-If you want to change an hotkey, the "keyboard" windows does not get focus after appearing, you can't change the hotkey by typing on your keyboard without clicking the window first.
-When the dialog appears asking if you really want to assign a shortcut already assigned, it would be more standard with the question: "are you sure ?", and then click ok, clicking cancel everytime is contrary to standard in windows apps and weird.
-You can't have the customize tools windows open and call the preference windows (for example): it result in a conflict of focus and the last window can't be closed, resulting in a "lock" situation.

BTW, good call on the Customize Modeling StreamLine Engine Tools" (error spelling in the title btw), it's definetely cool to be able to further tweak the app behaviour..

Just an update of what's been done so far.



http://www.digitalfossils.com/Downlo...rld-Nov-22.rar

Summary of changes

* The reported crash bug is fixed.

* MMB/Q click will auto complete primitive placement. Q will also close the tool.

* Snap point normal can be utilized in primitive creation. if the snap point is from a spline, the spline tangent at that point will be used.

* Edge color is part of the preferences.

* Edge G tool's NMB (No Mouse Btutton) action removed.

* Selection marquee cycling by Q is no more. When the selection_mode tool Q is activated, the square marquee tool will be turned on if it is not on already. While the selection_mode tool's hotkey is still pressed down, the lasso tool will be used if try to create marquee selection.

* Manipulator's orientation on edge/vertex selection improved. The manipulator's X axis will point along average normal if the orientation > selection option is chosen.

* Two more .obj export/import options are added regarding polygon grouping.

* Edge Loop/Ring select functions
> whole loop: double LMB same edge.
> whole ring: double MMb same edge.
> range loop: LMB select first edge, double LMB second edge.
> gap loop: MMB select first edge, double LMB second edge.
> range ring: LMB select first edge, double MMB second edge.
> gap ring: MMB select first edge, double MMB second edge.
> expand loop: select a rang/gap loop, move cursor to hilight a grow indication edge, [LMB and hold then MMB]/[MMB and hold then LMB] to execute range/gap expanding.

* Polygon loop select functions
> whole shell: double MMB same polygon
> range loop: LMB first polygon then double LMB second polygon.
> gap loop: MMB first polygon then double LMB second polygon.
> expand loop: select a rang/gap loop, move cursor to highlight a grow indication polygon, [LMB and hold then MMB]/[MMB and hold then LMB] to execute range/gap expanding.

* Winform focusing problems are fixed.

* Edge break into half function is added into streamline Cut tool. On activation, if the attempt to cut between edges failed, the programe will attempt to break the selected edges into half. Some users may not like this, so an option is added for this tool to disable it.

* In default setting, Loop/Ring select commands are hooked onto the On Activated event of the edge/polygon streamline G/H tools, so they will attempt to create loop/ring selection base on existing selection when the relative tool is activated.

* Tweak_Normal_Move tool has been reworked. By default, it is multi-selection enabled.

* By default, VW uses cursor Up/Down movement to perform transforming for some tools. some other apps may use Left/Right movement. So a customize option is provided through Edit > Preference.


Thanks!

The new edge ring/loop selection are very welcome and work well, except for ring select, you can't form a path with it without selecting whole rings.
And loop select should be working like that for polygons.

I like the tool group addition in customize tools !
And thanks for edge break, very useful.

Really cant wait to try it out again!

Also, Im not sure if its in already but I thought Id asked : what about anti-aliasing in the viewport ? I know it sounds like a small visual gadget BUT it really makes any 3D program more clear and nicer to use. It also makes complex scene easier to look at.

As a matter of fact, simply making sure that the program supports it throught the Nvidia control panel is enough. It might be doing that already ?

Anyways, cant wait to play with it!

I always dislike anti aliasing in max or cleartype in windows, makes everything so fuzzy and blurry and I constantly feel like I need glasses. Would be interesting to know how many other people at polycount prefer it that way. Also I find that the AA-lines in max for example look rather thick.

Originally Posted by BeatKitano

The new edge ring/loop selection are very welcome and work well, except for ring select, you can't form a path with it without selecting whole rings.
And loop select should be working like that for polygons.

I like the tool group addition in customize tools !
And thanks for edge break, very useful.

BeatKitano: Can you explain what is the path forming from ring you talk about? Including the polygon style.
Btw, there is no anti-aliasing feature at the moment.

Changes are great, loop/ring selection works really well and marquee/lasso implementation is brilliant.

I can't seem to get the snap point normal on primitive creation working or
the new expand loop method.

A bit of feedback on the other changes.

• G slide edges - there is some confusion now within this tool after the recent 'double-click selection method'. Currently as the tool stands there is no way to slide based on existing selections. I very rarely while modelling need to slide an entire edge loop and if I do I will usually double click select the entire loop then activate the edge slide tool. Would it be possible to change the LMB action on edge slide to 'Slide selected components'
• Left/Right movement to perform transforming is inverted from what I'm used to in other apps. Movement to the right should give positive values and vice versa. Preferably give the user the option to change. Also I personally think that these tools should use both up/down & left/right at the same time Similar to how you have Alt + RMB setup. I think checkboxes as opposed to radio buttons in the options would work best to give maximum customisation.

  ○ Up/Down

  ○ Invert Up/Down

  ○ Left/Right

  ○ Invert Left/Right

• Multi-selection should revert to whichever specific component is selected. This includes multi-selection on Shift. Currently adding to selections using Shift can be cancelled if the wrong component type is clicked. Reverting to single component selection based on what is currently selected will eliminate this problem.

Thanks

ghib: I made a vid regarding the primitive and loop-expand functions. Hope that help.

You Tube

The G + LMB is the only whole loop slide tool, so I should keep it. There is a selection slide tool already, V + MMB.

Originally Posted by IStonia

BeatKitano: Can you explain what is the path forming from ring you talk about? Including the polygon style.
Btw, there is no anti-aliasing feature at the moment.

Here's edge loop "pathing" (I don't know if a name exist for that, but i use it a ton when doing hard surface "freeform" modeling (it helps create shapes by beveling edges).

Here's two gifs explaining better I think:





About the poly part, well, it was really early here, don't know it works perfectly fine, you can ignore that ^^

@Beat Couldn't view your gif file. Is it too big to load?

Can we request mod or admin to make this thread stickied? I think it deserves attention and more involvement from PC members.