I would not say "enabled by default" but flipping faces with the clone modifier with 10 edit poly mod stacks does wonders to my files (read corrupt) for a good percentage of time.
Now here's a technical question for you guys to cheer you up a bit! It really bothered me many times today. Does anyone happen to know if there's an option in 3ds max that makes the program crash in the most inappropriate moments and is enabled by default? If yes, please let me know how to turn it off. Thanks.
I think when you got 2017 you must've checked the "Please destroy my anus" box in the installation wizard.
Jokes aside, why hasn't 17's instability been addressed yet? Does Autodesk even know they own 3DS?
Apologies if something similar has already been covered.
I'm interested to find out how you guys would create the corner that I've highlighted in the following image:
I've been playing around with this shape for some time now and can't seem to settle on a topology that I like - mainly because of that triangle like quad. There is no real issue with pinching / shading, but it's still bothering me and I'm curious to find out if there's a better way to terminate that edge loop. I'm trying to maintain the rounded curvature as seen in the reference image, so having the edge loops extend from that corner across the top part doesn't seem to be the solution.
Would really appreciate any suggestions, Thank you.
There is no real issue with pinching / shading, but it's still bothering me
[...]
Would really appreciate any suggestions, Thank you.
die slowly
I was just looking back through your posts on here Perna, before I posted my question. Got the impression you're a cool guy :> .... so yeah, thanks for your comment - much appreciated!
Alex1, if you want to make your life more difficult on purpose, that's the best advice I can give. When there are no visual issues there are no problems to fix.
I see your point now. I'll come back when I come across real issues, perhaps you could help me then. Thanks!
Thanks, it's working! (lmao) I still think a new 'all-pages' OP with huge letters would be the best move. First thing that people who have never been in the thread will see, unless they instantly scroll down to post
Hello, I've been asked to model this container, the model doesn't need to be super accurate so I did it in the least time possible. but out of curiosity, first of all If I it was your project would you do it in the steps as I did? (second picture) And the real question is how do you subtract two complex shapes with pro boolean? usually when I boolean (either union or subtraction) it's one complex geometry (the in progress model) and one standard geometry (e.g. the number 2 and 3 are just 2 simple boxes added with boolean) but how about when both geometries are complex? like the blue part I highlighted. matching the number of edges would be pain in the ass.
@perna correct me if I'm wrong but to me, something like this can be done with extrude but this, is 2 shapes merged to together and making it manually would take more time. and In my own mind, my previous post is closer to the latter.
another example would be barrel of the desert eagle, its a quarter of the capsule taken out of another cylinder but as it's not a perfect capsule. doing the boolean will help understanding the geometry and the transition better and the will decrease the manual work, that's why I try to use boolean I guess. If It's not much trouble and when you had some free time, can you do a 4 shot gif of how will you do the blue part of my previous post? cause in my head if you extrude that in, you have to do a lot of work to make that boxy shape round and tear like .
@perna is this close to what you are saying? my problem is that the part that goes in is complicated for me to understand, I mean what is the shape close to? it's deeper in left and shallower at the top. That's why I'm trying to use boolean, trying to simplify it in my head.
This should illustrate why I don't see how booleans have any place here. It's an organic shape. Not mechanical. Not mathematical. We're not subtracting a cylinder, sphere etc.
Thank you very much, I appreciate the time you put on it.
I'm no expert in this, but I think this is the type of topology you want to aim for (Right image: Quad only topo alternative):
It's good practice to retopologise in a way where your edge flow follows the same curvature that you've sculpted into the high poly mesh if you want to capture the finer details. The main issue with your retopo is that you don't have enough supporting geometry for the ends of the fin, so the solution is to get a nicer edge flow and manually cut in the extra edges in and position them into place.
@Alex1 Thanks so much! This looks a lot better than my approach. I was really struggling without those extra loops, but wasn't sure how to add them in.
So I've been reluctant to post this as the last thing I want is to do is look stupid for missing a page where it's been already said, but I've searched and found nothing and I'm having real difficulty with this shape. I've tried a plethora of ways to do it including booleans which honestly was more work than help, modelling the planes then combining it with a cylinder but I always get nasty transitions past the intersection. The part in question is the Mauser c96 barrel into front of the pistol
Here are some of the piss poor attempts, tbh I had got closer than these but deleted them and kept trying. The problem is the transition always has some evidence of the previous geometry, even with double loops.
I managed to get closer with this one by going way lower than I usually would with faces and it's closer, but the edges are really no where near as crisp as I want on the curve transition
I assume this could be done using nurbs or something or I'm just overlooking something that's staring me in the face. But I've been trying for a few hours now and it's really bumming me out. Any help would be much appreciated.
No worries, @Mossbros. While a few in this thread thread have cultivated the fear of asking questions in many people, I think most will appreciate you trying what you can and looking for answers first. One thing that, for me, is a huge deal but very underplayed in this thread: ngons. In this case, after cutting it with bools, I use edgeloops to reinforce the hard edges, and end in a pentagon at the corners. Afterward, you can probably just use a deformer or soft selection to warp it laterally into the odd shape it's in from your ref. Hope that helps! Also, feel free to take a look through my pinterest collection of hard surface topology. Having it all in one place has really helped me to learn. https://www.pinterest.com/Makkon06/hard-surface-topology/
@Perna@Makkon Thanks for the advice guys, I didn't really have a problem with doing as said (matching edges) as you can see with the examples of mine I showed. Looking at your examples I can see I was being stupid, and had forgot to continue the support edges back into the transition without spacing the edges.
I see everyone is making that shape, but it's not the shape on a c96 barrell.
The barrell has different size shapes and isn't a pentagon, it's pentagonal in sides, bit they aren't the same. Here's the final shape after figuring it out. The profile I was looking for was this shape
The pentagon shape is pretty easy, it was making these odd forms back into a cylinder that was bothering me. But with @Makkon 's suggestion to use FFD and @perna showing the bevel termination I managed to pull the shape
hello! I have a noob question, how can I add support edges to this object? I want to use turbosmooth. The hardest part are this triangular "wings". I will be grateful for your help!
Increasing number of segments also goes against the purpose as in a real production environment the part which is giving you trouble is almost always connected to other geometry already, making it non-trivial to alter its resolution and you need to work with what you've got.
...
Just out of curiosity (dunno if it's already been discussed), why not just go around, make the rest of the geometry, then go up a subdivision (turbosmooth -> collapse) and add the part that needs more geo/segment?
@perna I'm losing more and more self confidence, realizing I know almost nothing of subD modelling. I was working on it this car about a month or two ago and it is on hold right now. I took the first picture from a saved file, but it shows the progress. After making sure I had the general shape I added a turbosmooth (with smoothing groups or support edges), collapsed it and made the rest of the details. After your previous post now I'm feeling it was totally wrong. how could I have added edgeloops and keep the curvature? I was pretty confident with it's shading but now I think I over did it.
@perna I'm losing more and more self confidence, realizing I know almost nothing of subD modelling.
OK, so let's sort out your confidence issues.
I believe the culprit is passivity. It's terribly common. People do as they're told or follow any kind of majority voice instead of applying their own critical thinking. Logic. Intelligence. Weighing pros and cons.
If someone's going to be lazy they should at least own it and not get all frustrated about it.
I told you that invalidating the integrity of the sub-d cage defies the point of using sub-d in the first place, and you simplified that to mean "don't ever collapse a subdivision modifier", which falls in the camp of "never use n-gons" and questions in the form of "is it acceptable to...".
Self-confidence must be rooted in independent thought. Understand, analyze and challenge what is being said, regardless of who is saying it or how many people are saying it. As an example I've been ridiculing the idea of material metalness being binary for years, even though it used to be that the absolute majority here and even extremely skilled artists and programmers in highly respected companies would get all worked up about that. Just do your independent research and trust yourself to come to rational conclusions. If you lack the knowledge, simply aquire it.
If you believe someone is telling you not to use a technique that has actually worked for you in the past, challenge the notion, don't just accept that person as an authority and follow his "rules", especially if there's a chance you may have misunderstood what he was trying to tell you in the first place.
Here, I used exactly the same technique as you and it has nothing to do with what was said about collapsing cage models:
Thank you, that was relieving and at the same time made me think.
I am self trained, have not watched many tutorials and have not studied graphics or anything related in college. I studied computer software engineering. When I started sub-d modelling, I had problems with keeping edges straight, everything was wobbly. Then I learned about support edges. Then the problem was having the support edges yet maintaining the curvature. It took me a while to understand that adding support edges in places that need smooth flow, by hand will make shading problems and ruins the flow. Then I'm where I am now. I have a saying for myself, don't add the support edge by hand unless it's on a flat surface and let the subdivision/segment/side add the support edges for you It was a huge achievement for me, nothing was impossible anymore everything became clean with less distortion and shading errors. My mind was shaped around turbosmooth collapsing (or moar geo), and it was confidence boosting and at the same time raised the quality of my works. But today after reading that, it was a bit scary for me. I have to start not generalizing rules to every aspect of something.
@perna I think I understand but just to make it clear, if you had to continue modelling the car you posted, you will collapse it to like one higher division, but not any further and that will be the cage. The current mesh isn't the final cage yet, it was just a very lowpoly mesh with the least amount of edges and vertices to help making the cage with the best flow possible. hope I'm right.
@perna So I think my first post just got misunderstood, when I said
"Just out of curiosity (dunno if it's already been discussed), why not
just go around, make the rest of the geometry, then go up a subdivision
(turbosmooth -> collapse) and add the part that needs more
geo/segment?"
by making the rest of the geometry I meant going around doing what you already can do with the current mesh density, and when you can't go any further (like little details that need more geo) just collapse it add the details and another turbosmooth. But it's now more clear that if you can do the most with the least you'll have easier time later and if you miss a big part after you collapse it, you're doomed therefore collapse wisely.
Hey guys! New to the forums, thought this would be a good place to see how everyone would approach this.
A small backstory, I like to model stuff in 3D and when things aren't busy I find objects throughout my day to model, in this case, a water bottle top.
I am trying to do high poly modelling in 3ds max after 2 months. I'm trying to make this But idk how to progress to the high poly part... should I turbosmooth and support loop it?
I am trying to do high poly modelling in 3ds max after 2 months. I'm trying to make this But idk how to progress to the high poly part... should I turbosmooth and support loop it?
is that object one piece? if yes, than why? i literraly can't see that it's one piece on the concept. More of a panel going on and many pieces! Adding support loops or using quad chamfer will work, but be tedious because of the mesh!
But idk how to progress to the high poly part... should I turbosmooth and support loop it?
Hey @DeathstrokeFTW , Nice job! You've got the primary form down! and it looks like you are beginning to work on the secondary level of detail. I am a maya guy, so I am not sure if 3Ds Max has an edge loop tool. If so, My recommendation would be to add more polygons where you need it (i.e using edge loops and extrudes) and focus on a section while keeping in mind the other sections. I'll provide an example below that explains
TIPS: 1. I noticed from the concept art, is the futuristic server module looks pretty symmetrical. You can make your workflow faster by spending the time modeling half, and mirroring to complete the other half.
2. What will make you a strong modeler is your attention to details. You should be asking yourself all sorts of questions. "What is this piece used for?" "Why does this piece need so many exhaust ports on top" "what kind of materials are used to build this?" "Does this piece of machinery get used often, if so where?" Understanding why this object is important will allow you to properly model in details that would make sense. Imagine if you were to use this object, what kind of features you would need to use it.
3. Reference, Reference, Reference Is key to making this model shine. Start google searching different types of control modules and understand why certain knobs are used for certain tasks, look at bolt styles, and fabrication of metal pieces, wiring, etc.
Don't focus on the tools I am using in this .gif (different program), I just tried to make a quick video that explains the idea of focusing on a certain area while keeping in mind of the other areas, adding polygons where I need them to create details, then mirroring.
More than whiling to answer more questions if you have them, good luck!
But idk how to progress to the high poly part... should I turbosmooth and support loop it?
SNIP
Watching this is on Maya looks faster xD Thanks for the tips though. I tend to do low/mid poly meshes and then paint in normals to save time but the team wants to do high to low poly models and then bake the normals.
hi guys, I'm trying to create this laser beam thing and i was wondering how would you approach this laser eye ball in a ball shape, also i was wondering how would you build the material for the foggy reflective cool glass,
Hey @ebi, How's it going? I put this image together, just to help aid my thinking in approach to this model.
For the piece that encompasses the sphere, I would look at it as a sideways sphere: (btw, these were quickly modeled, and are definitely not the same as the image, but they get the point across)
and for the laser ball, I would look at it as a normal sphere with an extrude on the top.
For your Lens shader, I would play around with refraction and glossy settings, utilizing texture to add extra realism. Hope this can get you started :-)
hi @milldevi ! Thanks a lot for your effort! it does seem like the way i tried to take but if you look closely you can see the inside of the cutout ball is curved into a ball shape.. i couldn't succeed with the boolean to create that shape ..
hi @milldevi ! Thanks a lot for your effort! it does seem like the way i tried to take but if you look closely you can see the inside of the cutout ball is curved into a ball shape.. i couldn't succeed with the boolean to create that shape ..
Replies
Jokes aside, why hasn't 17's instability been addressed yet? Does Autodesk even know they own 3DS?
Apologies if something similar has already been covered.
I'm interested to find out how you guys would create the corner that I've highlighted in the following image:
I've been playing around with this shape for some time now and can't seem to settle on a topology that I like - mainly because of that triangle like quad. There is no real issue with pinching / shading, but it's still bothering me and I'm curious to find out if there's a better way to terminate that edge loop. I'm trying to maintain the rounded curvature as seen in the reference image, so having the edge loops extend from that corner across the top part doesn't seem to be the solution.
Would really appreciate any suggestions,
Thank you.
I still think a new 'all-pages' OP with huge letters would be the best move. First thing that people who have never been in the thread will see, unless they instantly scroll down to post
And the real question is how do you subtract two complex shapes with pro boolean? usually when I boolean (either union or subtraction) it's one complex geometry (the in progress model) and one standard geometry (e.g. the number 2 and 3 are just 2 simple boxes added with boolean) but how about when both geometries are complex? like the blue part I highlighted. matching the number of edges would be pain in the ass.
but this, is 2 shapes merged to together and making it manually would take more time.
and In my own mind, my previous post is closer to the latter.
another example would be barrel of the desert eagle, its a quarter of the capsule taken out of another cylinder but as it's not a perfect capsule. doing the boolean will help understanding the geometry and the transition better and the will decrease the manual work, that's why I try to use boolean I guess.
If It's not much trouble and when you had some free time, can you do a 4 shot gif of how will you do the blue part of my previous post? cause in my head if you extrude that in, you have to do a lot of work to make that boxy shape round and tear like .
I've been working on retopologizing this fish fin and I'm totally puzzled on how to go about doing it.
I've made three or four attempts but the topology keeps ending up a complete mess. I'm about to restart for a 5th time.
How would you all approach this? (And if there's a more appropriate thread for me to be asking this stuff, please advise.)
It's good practice to retopologise in a way where your edge flow follows the same curvature that you've sculpted into the high poly mesh if you want to capture the finer details. The main issue with your retopo is that you don't have enough supporting geometry for the ends of the fin, so the solution is to get a nicer edge flow and manually cut in the extra edges in and position them into place.
Here's a better picture of something similar:
eyeballed it
The part in question is the Mauser c96 barrel into front of the pistol
Here are some of the piss poor attempts, tbh I had got closer than these but deleted them and kept trying.
The problem is the transition always has some evidence of the previous geometry, even with double loops.
I managed to get closer with this one by going way lower than I usually would with faces and it's closer, but the edges are really no where near as crisp as I want on the curve transition
I assume this could be done using nurbs or something or I'm just overlooking something that's staring me in the face. But I've been trying for a few hours now and it's really bumming me out.
Any help would be much appreciated.
One thing that, for me, is a huge deal but very underplayed in this thread: ngons. In this case, after cutting it with bools, I use edgeloops to reinforce the hard edges, and end in a pentagon at the corners.
Afterward, you can probably just use a deformer or soft selection to warp it laterally into the odd shape it's in from your ref. Hope that helps!
Also, feel free to take a look through my pinterest collection of hard surface topology. Having it all in one place has really helped me to learn.
https://www.pinterest.com/Makkon06/hard-surface-topology/
Thanks for the advice guys, I didn't really have a problem with doing as said (matching edges) as you can see with the examples of mine I showed.
Looking at your examples I can see I was being stupid, and had forgot to continue the support edges back into the transition without spacing the edges.
The barrell has different size shapes and isn't a pentagon, it's pentagonal in sides, bit they aren't the same.
Here's the final shape after figuring it out.
The profile I was looking for was this shape
The pentagon shape is pretty easy, it was making these odd forms back into a cylinder that was bothering me. But with @Makkon 's suggestion to use FFD and @perna showing the bevel termination I managed to pull the shape
I'm not saying it has to be, just that it's harder to make said shape in the primary question than the one shown.
I have a noob question, how can I add support edges to this object? I want to use turbosmooth. The hardest part are this triangular "wings".
I will be grateful for your help!
and here's one with overkill (using 46 sides instead of yours 16 and using the topology of that cylinder for supporting loops).
I was working on it this car about a month or two ago and it is on hold right now. I took the first picture from a saved file, but it shows the progress.
After making sure I had the general shape I added a turbosmooth (with smoothing groups or support edges), collapsed it and made the rest of the details. After your previous post now I'm feeling it was totally wrong. how could I have added edgeloops and keep the curvature?
I was pretty confident with it's shading but now I think I over did it.
I am self trained, have not watched many tutorials and have not studied graphics or anything related in college. I studied computer software engineering.
When I started sub-d modelling, I had problems with keeping edges straight, everything was wobbly. Then I learned about support edges. Then the problem was having the support edges yet maintaining the curvature. It took me a while to understand that adding support edges in places that need smooth flow, by hand will make shading problems and ruins the flow. Then I'm where I am now. I have a saying for myself, don't add the support edge by hand unless it's on a flat surface and let the subdivision/segment/side add the support edges for you It was a huge achievement for me, nothing was impossible anymore everything became clean with less distortion and shading errors.
My mind was shaped around turbosmooth collapsing (or moar geo), and it was confidence boosting and at the same time raised the quality of my works.
But today after reading that, it was a bit scary for me.
I have to start not generalizing rules to every aspect of something.
"Just out of curiosity (dunno if it's already been discussed), why not just go around, make the rest of the geometry, then go up a subdivision (turbosmooth -> collapse) and add the part that needs more geo/segment?"
by making the rest of the geometry I meant going around doing what you already can do with the current mesh density, and when you can't go any further (like little details that need more geo) just collapse it add the details and another turbosmooth. But it's now more clear that if you can do the most with the least you'll have easier time later and if you miss a big part after you collapse it, you're doomed therefore collapse wisely.
Thanks Perna.
A small backstory, I like to model stuff in 3D and when things aren't busy I find objects throughout my day to model, in this case, a water bottle top.
But idk how to progress to the high poly part... should I turbosmooth and support loop it?
Adding support loops or using quad chamfer will work, but be tedious because of the mesh!
Nice job! You've got the primary form down! and it looks like you are beginning to work on the secondary level of detail. I am a maya guy, so I am not sure if 3Ds Max has an edge loop tool. If so, My recommendation would be to add more polygons where you need it (i.e using edge loops and extrudes) and focus on a section while keeping in mind the other sections. I'll provide an example below that explains
TIPS:
1. I noticed from the concept art, is the futuristic server module looks pretty symmetrical. You can make your workflow faster by spending the time modeling half, and mirroring to complete the other half.
2. What will make you a strong modeler is your attention to details. You should be asking yourself all sorts of questions. "What is this piece used for?" "Why does this piece need so many exhaust ports on top" "what kind of materials are used to build this?" "Does this piece of machinery get used often, if so where?" Understanding why this object is important will allow you to properly model in details that would make sense. Imagine if you were to use this object, what kind of features you would need to use it.
3. Reference, Reference, Reference Is key to making this model shine. Start google searching different types of control modules and understand why certain knobs are used for certain tasks, look at bolt styles, and fabrication of metal pieces, wiring, etc.
Don't focus on the tools I am using in this .gif (different program), I just tried to make a quick video that explains the idea of focusing on a certain area while keeping in mind of the other areas, adding polygons where I need them to create details, then mirroring.
More than whiling to answer more questions if you have them, good luck!
Thanks for the tips though. I tend to do low/mid poly meshes and then paint in normals to save time but the team wants to do high to low poly models and then bake the normals.
I'm trying to create this laser beam thing and i was wondering how would you approach this laser eye ball in a ball shape, also i was wondering how would you build the material for the foggy reflective cool glass,
I put this image together, just to help aid my thinking in approach to this model.
For the piece that encompasses the sphere, I would look at it as a sideways sphere: (btw, these were quickly modeled, and are definitely not the same as the image, but they get the point across)
and for the laser ball, I would look at it as a normal sphere with an extrude on the top.
For your Lens shader, I would play around with refraction and glossy settings, utilizing texture to add extra realism.
Hope this can get you started :-)
Thanks a lot for your effort! it does seem like the way i tried to take but if you look closely you can see the inside of the cutout ball is curved into a ball shape.. i couldn't succeed with the boolean to create that shape ..
this script here might help also u can take it to zbrush and bollean it if thats not a problem