I'm not as worried about NK as Iran. Reason being, that culture does not exude a hatred for western ways and cultures that anyone without their head in the sand realizes is very strong in the Middle East. It's far more plausible to me to see someone in Iran sneaking a small nuclear device into the U.S and detonating it on U.S soil than someone from NK. There just is no precedent for this amongst Asian cultures, which are among the most civilized and honorable on the planet. Yes Kim Song Joo is a madman, and has the worst hair in the history of dictators, LOL, but does anyone honestly think he's going to fire a missile at the U.S? First off, he'd be lucky to have the technology to even develop a missile that could reach Alaska, much less the U.S West Coast. Secondly, if the missile wasn't plucked out of the sky before it landed, having his country turned into a pile of radioactive rubble is probably not something even a man that crazy is looking for. The bottom line is, he wants leverage to get sanctions removed from his country for restarting his nuclear program in the first place.

This is really China's problem, and the U.S. is leaving it up to them. I can't see us getting involved too much. I think Kerry wanted to, but that would have been a major mistake.

As far as Iran, invading them would be easy enough, given their lack of military strength and the fact that we are right next door already. I think the reason that Iran is negotiating, is because of that. If we weren't already in Iraq, Iran would be alot more defiant.

Regarding India and Pakistan, those countries already had the bomb before those treaties took place in the 80's.

Oh please. Do you think that we are going to invade Scotland? Think we are going to have some radical Christians strap some bombs to their backs and blow up a school?

Think Bush is really a tyrannical christian dictator who is going to take over the world and impose the will of the west on your country? C-mon, these kinds of statements are really out there.

"Think Bush is really a tyrannical christian dictator who is going to take over the world"

No, I dont think he'll manage it.

frosty, I apologize for the religious jab and I agree it is too sweeping. I'm a beer drinking gun toter (so that's 2 out of 3!) but I'm against a war with Iran without provocation. You may hear more sympathy in Christian circles, but I hear more sympathy in non-Christian circles - I think it just all depends on who you hang out with [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

Hey Slegy no need to apoligize mate. As far as who I hang out with, well actually nobody but you guys and my wife. My draw on the who is in more sympathy is basically local co-workers and community, neighbor’s and local readings. Although I know you and I on a polycount global scale are nearly neighbor’s, I am sure we hear varied opinions. My very local neighbor’s are basically just good old boys with guns and usually putting away a 12 on weekends, Saturday and Sunday. Btw, I just had some pizza at one of your local shops, I think Yebo’s or something like that, and it was the biggest pizza I have ever seen! [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Irritant – I don’t think Rick see the U.S. as an Ally to the UK. : )
(John, btw that pic of you is cool and she is so hot!) : )

[ QUOTE ]
"Why are the powerful countries allowed nuclear weapons and not us?"

[/ QUOTE ]

Hm. When MoP wrote that, he used the word 'energy'. Why did you change it to the word 'weapons'? Or where you intendeding that to be a separate topic?

ANyway, with regards to nuclear energy, other nations are allowed to have it as long as they abide by international guidelines. The question, of course, is simple - are the Iranians processing nuclear material for energy generation as they claim, or doing so as a precursor to weapons to development? If Iran allows the IAEA to fully inspect the Iranian nuclear program and they report that everything is entirely on the up-and-up, Iran is in the clear.

[ QUOTE ]
If I was in Iran I'd be asking the same questions. Why are they not allowed to develop a nuclear arsenal?

[/ QUOTE ]

If you were Iran, you'd know that you voluntarily signed the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty in 1970 and endorsed the extension again in 2003, stating that you will cooperate with the IAEA and not pursue nuclear weapon technology. Of course, if you were Iran, you'd probably also know that you've been secretly working on nuclear weapon development since the 1980s, just in case.

Vermillion, I misread his post. Your response is correct of course.

Entering the Nuclear Club is an international status thing, it's like buying an exotic sports car. More often than not those rich old guys who buy them don't street race, similarly, the only bomb dropped in a time of war was in 1945.

Furthermore, just before the test ban treaty was first drafted the USSR tested a 50 megaton thermonuclear device that was downgraded froma yeild of 100 megatons. Everyone developing that project admitted that it was completely inconcievable as a weapon of war.

When Pakistan developed their nuclear program they tested it, screamed real loud and now they have America as an ally. (a muslim country, there aren't too many btw) Almost all of America's key allies have a nuclear weapons program. I'm not suggesting iran wants to be an American ally, but if you wanna play with the big boys, it seems you gotta get some big toys.

Dad makes the rules, and the kids learn first by example and then by listening. Americans involved who draft foriegn poilicy should understand that.

-R

Read this guy's collums for the "Long View" of what is happening in the current war.

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/others/spengler.html

it's a lot more complicated than it seems.

Scott


Scott