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London Fischer - Guide to Making Our Model

Not all of us can be as artistically inclined as some on this site. It would be nice if I could take a cube, apply a multi-resolution modifier in Blender, and crank out a masterpiece. But I just can't...and I know there's quite a few others out there that suffer the same disfunction :)

I've created a walk-through of the process I use to create a realistic looking model for the new movie series I'm working on, Earth: Primeval. I know I can't make it look perfect, but I also know that I want realistic results or it's just not worth the time and effort.

The first 9 parts are now complete, and the end-result of each step is detailed below. We have now completed the 'body' portion of this series, along with adding a new, posable topology to her head and face. Next up, we'll be adding skin texture and modeling her armor, weapons, and equipment. I hope you take the time to see how I do it, and welcome any input or insight you may have.


Step 9 - Refining Head and Face
http://www.earthprimeval.com/blog/concept-to-reality-the-making-of-london-fischer-pt-9

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Step 8 - Head and Face - Retopology
http://www.earthprimeval.com/blog/concept-to-reality-the-making-of-london-fischer-pt-8

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Step 7 - Redefining Lower Body, Legs, and Feet
http://www.earthprimeval.com/blog/concept-to-reality-the-making-of-london-fischer-pt-7

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Step 6 - Redefining Chest, Abdomen, and Back
http://www.earthprimeval.com/blog/concept-to-reality-the-making-of-london-fischer-pt-6

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Step 5 - Redefining Shoulders, Arms, and Hands
http://www.earthprimeval.com/blog/concept-to-reality-the-making-of-london-fischer-pt5

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Step 4 - Retopology - Creating a Usable Base Mesh
http://www.earthprimeval.com/blog/concept-to-reality-the-making-of-london-fischer-pt-4

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Step 3 - Using Dynamic Topology to Sculpt a Base Model
http://www.earthprimeval.com/blog/concept-to-reality-making-of-london-fischer-pt-3

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Step 2 - Use Skin Modifier to Generate Skeletal Structure
http://www.earthprimeval.com/blog/concept-to-reality-the-making-of-london-fischer-pt-2

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Step 1 - Series Introduction
http://www.earthprimeval.com/blog/concept-to-reality-the-making-of-london-fischer-pt-1

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Replies

  • Brian "Panda" Choi
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    Brian "Panda" Choi high dynamic range
    Are you looking for critiques by any chance?

    It might be better if you kept additional updates collated into one thread instead of several for this film.
  • scotthomer
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    Hey,

    I think one thing I would say, is that it would probably be better for you to take on board some critique for your character model before preaching it as a tutorial. I fully respect your desire to help people out, but I can see some glaring issues with the construction of your model, pinches, anatomical issues etc that really undermine the quality of your teaching. My advice would've been to post your model up independently of the tutorial, get some feedback, make it perfect, then break it down.

    Anyway, take that with a pinch of salt, I appreciate the sentiment, but bad advice is worse than no advice.

    Scott.
  • BagelHero
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    BagelHero interpolator
    Not all of us can be as artistically inclined as some on this site. It would be nice if I could take a cube, apply a multi-resolution modifier in Blender, and crank out a masterpiece. But I just can't...and I know there's quite a few others out there that suffer the same disfunction

    It's not a dysfunction. It's a matter of practice and focused training. You'll never be able to just subdiv a cube and have something incredible, but neither will the masters at this. They've just got the knowledge down already so the base steps just come to them quicker, aside from general predisposition there's nothing else to it.

    Also, +1 to Scott and Brian.
  • earthprimeval
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    The 'cube to masterpiece' line is referring to this post on blenderartists.org:

    http://blenderartists.org/forum/showthread.php?193068-Unlimeted-Clay-models-Aleksaurio

    Indeed, he took a single cube and made some pretty amazing 3d art. The idea behind my series is...I know I can never do that, even with a lot of practice. Regardless of experience and training, there's a certain level of artistry required to create something that truly captures the attention and detail that makes people take notice.

    I know my limitations, and worked hard to find a way of producing something that I could be proud of, even without that innate artistic ability...so I assure you, 'preachy' is the last thing that I mean to portray.

    I'm sure the gentleman referenced above would have no use for the method I've come up with...but if there's someone else out there that struggled like me, had a creative idea but lacked the means to execute it, then just maybe they'll learn something different or realize that just because something starts out looking like a 'high school Play Doh model', it can't end up looking like something they can be proud of.

    And sorry for starting a second thread...when I posted the first one, I didn't feel I conveyed the message I wanted about why I'm creating this series and who the target audience was.

    The series itself is on step 2 of about 20, so I'm well aware how 'unrefined' it looks right now, but I appreciate your observations, and of course would accept any criticism.
  • BagelHero
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    BagelHero interpolator
    While I do appreciate where you're coming from,
    I know I can never do that, even with a lot of practice.
    When I say it's just a matter of practice, I'm serious.

    A lot of sculptors start with highly subdiv'd spheres. Taking a highly subdivided whatever and noodling forms out of it is hardly impressive. We can all do that (and anyone who's DLd Sculptris, played with Blender or purchased Zbrush or Mudbox already has). The idea of using regularly poly-modeled human bases isn't new, either. Lots of people use them to speed up their workflow, even if for personal sketches they still use cubes or spheres.

    Moreover, you are actually entirely capable of that and yes, you could achieve the level of quality in that guys' thread via practicing. You are capable, and the only thing stopping you is the attitude that you can't (and potentially other commitments if you've no intention of ever taking your art to a place where it's marketable). It's poisonous, and will make you settle for less than what you can actually do.


    I think anyone who's hung out around Polycount (or any other art forum, honestly) for long enough has seen an amateur grow into a professional by just sticking to it and developing their sense of form, anatomy and aesthetic. And trust me, many of them have had a much worse starting point than you in this area. Like... much worse.
    This isn't even all bad, it's just coming off as odd here, I think, because you're presenting this as a tutorial to people here who already know the basics (read as: actual industry professionals who do character art as a living) instead of asking what you could do to improve or just casually posting your progress, which is just what a lot of people here do, and what people expect of this section.


    As for this piece in particular, it's certainly not a matter of it being "unrefined". Your details, actually, are pretty decent from what I can see. But your basic forms are just not there to support that-- muscles in the wrong places, proportions incorrect, unappealing stiff forms, uncanny face... These are all things that get better with focused practice and feedback. And also, all things you could go back and revise.

    To get this, a lot of other people have threads where they post their art and people can reply to those updates directly, suggesting changes and helping along as the piece progresses. You might want to do something like that until you have an awesome model-- that's what Scott was suggesting you do.

    This is as opposed to posting something that's pretty far down the track and that you're attached to and proud of, only to have people storm in and tell you it's not all that great after all. Because that sucks (we've all done it before though, at some point).


    I have a terrible habit of writing novels, sorry if I came across as anything but a little concerned and trying to help. I really believe that people who can't learn art are the extreme exception, and most regular schmoes are entirely capable. It's just hard. But you're already showing yourself to be more than a schmoe, so why couldn't you reach that level of artistry? It's just knowledge, and anyone can learn it (there's no blood test to get in!), so I say go for it rather than handicapping yourself preemptively.

    Other than that long as heck post, until you post front and side refs or start a progress thread or whatever, there's nothing concrete and technical I can tell you to work on. so take this instead.
    https://www.anatomy4sculptors.com/anatomy.php

    There are lots of easy to remember measurements, tips and tricks as opposed to vague artistic terms. Maybe that will help you into the future, if you can apply yourself. I especially recommend checking all the tabs in every section, I've always found "blockouts" and "secrets" to be the most useful.

    :thumbup:
  • earthprimeval
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    I appreciate your reply and direction. I have looked into the resources you referenced and am happy to see that I actually DO utilize some of the techniques you mention...I just always referred to it as 'creating face loops along muscles and bone structure' as opposed to calling it 'blockouts'. I think I prefer the proper term :)

    At any rate, the 'raw' sculpting process was so I could lay the ground word for the step I'm on now...retopology. The black model above is where I'm at after applying an actual topology to the base sculpted mesh.

    The next step should be completed soon, I would definitely welcome any insight you have once I create a real working mesh and have something a little more concrete to demonstrate :)
  • earthprimeval
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    Finished Retopology. Will be adding detail to the new mesh and refining muscle definition in the next step.

    View Part 4 of our series here:
    http://www.earthprimeval.com/blog/concept-to-reality-the-making-of-london-fischer-pt-4

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  • jfeez
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    jfeez polycounter lvl 8
    Don't devalue yourself by saying i can never achieve that. Yes its important to know your limitations but only so you can get better. Cant do something, fucking learn it. Anyway enough preachy rubbish, looking at this model, for you to get better you really need to study anatomy/form/proportion, do some scott eaton or ryan kingslien stuff, or one of the many many good anatomy series out there.. You say you want realism, learn this and spend a few months just doing it, your work will be a 1000x better
  • earthprimeval
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    I appreciate how 'engaging' this forum's community is. Very forthcoming, yet not condescending. Pushing, without berating...I admire that.

    I think my initial concept art may have lead to some confusion. It was pretty stylized, and I think that may have been the focus of a few comments I've received, both personally and via this post...so I removed it to avoid further confusion.

    As to the series, part 5 is completed...defining the Shoulders, Arms, and Hands. I'm pleased with the progress so far and hope it's of help to someone that's working on a similar project.

    http://www.earthprimeval.com/blog/concept-to-reality-the-making-of-london-fischer-pt5

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  • earthprimeval
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    Finished Step 6 earlier today...in this part, I redefined her abdomen, chest, and back. Things are beginning to take shape!

    http://www.earthprimeval.com/blog/concept-to-reality-the-making-of-london-fischer-pt-6

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    Pt6-Before_and_After_02.png

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  • earthprimeval
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    Step 7 is complete, and with that concludes the 'body' portion of our series.

    I'll be moving onto the Face and Head in the next step, then onto modeling her armor, equipment, and weapons.

    Check out our project at www.earthprimeval.com

    And click here to start over from the beginning of our series.

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  • Brian "Panda" Choi
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    Brian "Panda" Choi high dynamic range
    Do you have an orthographic view of the body?
  • earthprimeval
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    You prefer wireframe or rendered?
  • Brian "Panda" Choi
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    Brian "Panda" Choi high dynamic range
    Rendered, but readable so we can check proportions and anatomical forms.
  • earthprimeval
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    Front, Side, and Back...as-requested

    13796_orig.png
  • Brian "Panda" Choi
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    Brian "Panda" Choi high dynamic range
    Her hips could be pulled out to the sides more. Right now, the overall shape of the torso reads as a top heavy V, which is more indicative of a male body than a female. Hips should roughly be as wide or a little wider than the shoulder breadth, as a rule of thumb.

    Her deltoids feel extremely rounded for an anatomically accurate model. There should be slight planar changes on the surface.

    Topology I'm assuming you're being super detailed with.
  • BagelHero
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    BagelHero interpolator
    I hope you don't mind this, but I did a bit of a paintover.
    Look, as I said previously, nothing is wrong with your detailing and your topology is good etc-- but you're iterating on top of these flawed base forms. If you had spent more time then, you would have a better product right now.
    This is dodgy, I snuck it in at work and most of it's the liquefy tool but hopefully it gets the point across. Your side view is the bit that I changed most dramatically.

    548f6c40f19dd.png

    I hope this can help you.
    Remember to use lots of ref that isn't just your model.
    eg, https://www.anatomy4sculptors.com/anatomy.php
    https://www.pinterest.com/characterdesigh/
    http://media.creativebloq.futurecdn.net/sites/creativebloq.com/files/images/2014/03/female1.jpg
    http://media.creativebloq.futurecdn.net/sites/creativebloq.com/files/images/2014/07/torso8.jpg
  • earthprimeval
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    Thank you both for the critique, and for what it's worth, I agree on a few points. I noticed her slightly broader shoulders early on...perhaps it was the perspective of the original photo, but I've made a subtle adjustment to make that area a little more 'feminine'.

    With regard to her leg muscles, I envision this character as having a 'gymnast' build. Using several reference photos of leg musculature, I tried to emulate as close as possible. I did straighten the hamstring slightly, and gave a little more depth to her quads, all while keeping the overall leg 'strength' intact.

    I believe I might rework the back. My initial topology started to mirror that musculature, but it evened out as I went up the back and lost some of that definition.

    Thanks again for the advice...it's much-appreciated :)
  • earthprimeval
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    Finished the retopology step on her head and face. Next up, we'll do a lot of refining of her facial features and add those subtle (or not so subtle) details around her lips, nose, and eyes.

    http://www.earthprimeval.com/blog/concept-to-reality-the-making-of-london-fischer-pt-8


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  • Brian "Panda" Choi
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    Brian "Panda" Choi high dynamic range
    I feel like your 3/4 shots aren't QUITE 3/4 shots. Might help if you turned the camera a little closer to the front to capture everythang.
  • earthprimeval
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    I'll work on the angle...in the meantime, I didn't like releasing the retopology render as I know the facial features left a lot to be desired, so here's a quick side-by-side to show what I've done so far to refine the face and head.

    Brought out detail in the mouth, nose, and eyes, as well as tweaking the form of the ear slightly. The eyes, eyebrows, and eyelashes are just placeholders to help frame the features.

    Step 9 should be finished soon...then, on to texturing!

    7291931_orig.png
  • earthprimeval
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    No, I think you're right now that you say it. I'm thinking I got caught working in orthographic mode rather than perspective and some of my proportions got skewed.

    Going back to my reference images to see if I can make a few subtle adjustments. Thanks for the feedback! Sometimes you stare at something so long you don't notice the inconsistencies :)
  • Mask_Salesman
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    Mask_Salesman polycounter lvl 13
    TLDR; looks like your hard modelling this instead of sculpting it in zbrush etc, seems like your making it needlessly difficult :/
  • earthprimeval
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    Took ProjectEagleEye's advice and revisited my head proportions before finishing up this next step...much happier with the results. And with this step, the 'body modeling' is complete! Next we'll work on adding a skin texture, then onto her clothes and armor :)

    http://www.earthprimeval.com/blog/concept-to-reality-the-making-of-london-fischer-pt-9

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