Werewolf (almost finished, need feedback )
Current:
Update and what I have to do: http://www.polycount.com/forum/showthread.php?p=1757614#post1759093
I wrote almost finished on my title, but now I realise it is not even close to be done. Don't worry about the render; I'll redo it later. For now, I need to know what doesn't work in the anatomy. I'm currently scooting my references and my anatomy books to find out. The way I made my project is that I can change it and don't have to do that much work in 3ds to redo a render (in case of geometry change, for example). So even if the geometry change by 80%, I'd still be able to retake it into 3DS, do a few changes and rerender it the way you see it in the picture in this thread.
Good evening everyone!
So the past week I've been working on a personal project of mine. During my last school session, we had to create our own head in zbrush; it was pretty much the 1st time we used it and we didn't push it very far. None the less, I really liked my projet and said to myself I'd work on it this winter. So here I am now, posting on polycount a very advanced version of my project! It is mainly based on Teen Wolf Werewolves, so it can be considered as a piece of fan art. Love that show seriously. Anyway, here it is (it is not the final version, I have many things I'm not quite sure):
This is my current result after a load of zbrush tutorials and a huge book, along with 6 months of v-ray tutorial reading and a ton of head-banging on my desk. Here are my current issues with the project:
- The eyes doesn't look quite realistic. I believe it has to do with the reflection. I've been searching a lot about how to create some realistic reflections, sadly everytime I tried it gave either a glass material or my eye became a mirror. I might do it in photoshop in post-prod.
- The lips' texture. There something that just seems off on them, can't tell what and it's annoying me.
- The eyebrow. My friends who I've asked about them said they were more than fine, but to me they seems a little... fake? I think it's more a matter of perspective?
- The nose. Not sure about this one, but the geometry doesn't look right. Can't tell if it's the bubble or the nose holes (dunno the real english word for these, but I guess you guys get it XD).
- And finally the teeth. This one doesn't come from me but rather a friend of mine; she say the two front teeth are too big for the mouth. On my side they seems perfect the way they are, but with such an ambitious project I don't want to take any chance.
I just can't put the finger on what to correct. I'll keep looking on what to correct, but I'll need you guys help, if it can just be on one or two of these points.
Thanks,
Lurianar
Update and what I have to do: http://www.polycount.com/forum/showthread.php?p=1757614#post1759093
I wrote almost finished on my title, but now I realise it is not even close to be done. Don't worry about the render; I'll redo it later. For now, I need to know what doesn't work in the anatomy. I'm currently scooting my references and my anatomy books to find out. The way I made my project is that I can change it and don't have to do that much work in 3ds to redo a render (in case of geometry change, for example). So even if the geometry change by 80%, I'd still be able to retake it into 3DS, do a few changes and rerender it the way you see it in the picture in this thread.
Good evening everyone!
So the past week I've been working on a personal project of mine. During my last school session, we had to create our own head in zbrush; it was pretty much the 1st time we used it and we didn't push it very far. None the less, I really liked my projet and said to myself I'd work on it this winter. So here I am now, posting on polycount a very advanced version of my project! It is mainly based on Teen Wolf Werewolves, so it can be considered as a piece of fan art. Love that show seriously. Anyway, here it is (it is not the final version, I have many things I'm not quite sure):
This is my current result after a load of zbrush tutorials and a huge book, along with 6 months of v-ray tutorial reading and a ton of head-banging on my desk. Here are my current issues with the project:
- The eyes doesn't look quite realistic. I believe it has to do with the reflection. I've been searching a lot about how to create some realistic reflections, sadly everytime I tried it gave either a glass material or my eye became a mirror. I might do it in photoshop in post-prod.
- The lips' texture. There something that just seems off on them, can't tell what and it's annoying me.
- The eyebrow. My friends who I've asked about them said they were more than fine, but to me they seems a little... fake? I think it's more a matter of perspective?
- The nose. Not sure about this one, but the geometry doesn't look right. Can't tell if it's the bubble or the nose holes (dunno the real english word for these, but I guess you guys get it XD).
- And finally the teeth. This one doesn't come from me but rather a friend of mine; she say the two front teeth are too big for the mouth. On my side they seems perfect the way they are, but with such an ambitious project I don't want to take any chance.
I just can't put the finger on what to correct. I'll keep looking on what to correct, but I'll need you guys help, if it can just be on one or two of these points.
Thanks,
Lurianar
Replies
I need to know. Even if my project get destroyed, when you put a hundred hour on a project you'd like to know what you did right or wrong. Thanks for your understanding.
ATM there's way too much spec in your hair and it's just doesn't look right at all.
Also check at ref's for facial anatomy, there's some strange blob happening around the nose. If you could show an unshaded or zbrush render maybe we could help a bit more with the forms.
can't help it, but he looks more fishy than werewolfy.
I don't really dig the concept of the whole. He looks like he's halfway through his transformation from human to werewolf. Partly comes from these factors:
- he doesn't seem to have a nasal bone
- his eyes seem way too far apart, while his skull still follows the general form of a humanoid skull. I guess you tried to move the eyes to the side, but didn't stretch the head while doing that.
However, as you probably are not able to work on these points anymore, I agree on the points you mentioned.
The lips basically miss some more structure.
Eyebrows really look weird, not sure why.
Keep it up though!
I like the sculpt and there were a few things I noticed.
1. The teeth, I don't know it this is a inbetween shot from human to werewolf but wolf like animals have long K9 teeth. Though the mandible has the maxilla lacks them. Try to balance that out. A good reference would be Underworld 2, the hybrid between Lycans (werewolfs) and the vampires.
For colour, try to make them a bit more yellow-ish. This will enhance the idea of wolf teeth. Research some wolf teeth of the internet or if you have yourself, dog teeth.
2. The hair, is this rendered with post process of hair simulation? Some of the hairs can better be added in the texture of the skin, like the hairs on the throat. By making it a bit grey there you add the illusion of tiny hairs left after shaving
The ends of the hair are in need of more transparency and less specular. Maybe you can add some colour variation to the hair. Wolves rarely have one colour of hair.
For example
Balancing the human and wolf sides will be difficult.
3. The lips, I get the feeling they are bit too light, a bit too much skin like textured. Also the lips have wrinkles which are visible when the mouth is closed and open. This definitely will add the contrast of skin to mouth.
I think you are already on the right path, your result so far is very nice.
This was what I noticed and think.
Good luck with the project!
True. Yet again, this is the only place I know for feedback; if I can't get some here, where will I have some?
You're right. No I'm not in a rush, but when I remember my last two post, both have been forgotten and barely had any feedback; I feared it would happen again. I agree on the hair. I'll take a look immediately at what I can do to make them look more realistic! As for the facial anatomy, here's two zbrush view of my project.
Just take note this is the version in max, since I worked on the geometry again in it. This is not the original zbrush project I had and that I used for the normal map.
Oh, I can work on those points. And I will
1. Will do a research on them like you said. If it can look more realistic, I'll do everything it need. Seriously.
2. They were made in zbrush and exported into 3DS MAX, hence why the texture ain't the best. I'll rework on them the way they deserve to be; I agree on every point and I'm working on it asap.
3. Fair too. Wasn't sure if I should keep them more skin-like or make them more reddish. My last red version seemed like he had some lips gloss, which wasn't exactly the wanted result as you can guess XD In any case, it's also on my priority list.
When I was about to abandon, you guys showed me I was completely wrong. The help you gave me might seems small, but in reality it's huge. You've put a smile in my face this morning. I'll put a new render as soon as those modifications are done; as for the bone structure, any feedback is welcome as it seems it's in deep need of rework. I'm online the whole day, so I'll check this thread pretty often. All your comments are noted and will be worked on!
EDIT: I thought maybe posting some of my references would help:
http://images.wikia.com/teenwolf/images/8/84/Isaac.jpg
http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20120620045920/teenwolf/images/1/18/Scott_Werewolf.png
http://images.wikia.com/teenwolf/images/f/f0/DerekWerewolf.jpg
Render:
Zbrush:
So yeah, my character probably changed a bit too much from the original render. But I believe the skull fit better. I didn't start to work on the muscles yet. Tried to yellow the teeth a bit, but I'll spend more time tweaking them later. Am I on the right way?
So as of now, there are the few things that need some work:
I haven't worked on the eyebrow yet. But I will -- if it's not today it's tomorrow.
Rework the nose (I did work on the nose, but the result ain't the one I'm looking for yet. Damn, the base of it... ugh) I'll also rework the forehead muscles. I'll take a few pictures of my own to work from them; none the less I spent a lot of time studying the face muscles today and learned a lot from it).
Probably rework the general geometry. I do believe however that this result is much better than the 1st one.
Head hair have a weird shape (primarily the one on top of his head, compared to the 1st render. Probably a mistake I did while undergoing the bigger changes)
What changed:
A good deal of the general geometry (both on the skull/muscles sides. This is where I spent most of my time today);
Add more realism to the hair (Wanted to give them a solid look, less from the wolf side but more from the human side. Might go for the first one if this one really doesn't work however);
Yellowish the teeth;
Give them a more werewolf look (Still need to work the front teeth too, after looking on a few references I realized they're too human-looking);
More color to the lips (which might not be enough yet, to see). I also added some bump on them, but as I can see it's not as powerful as I thought.
If something is weird and need correction on the facial geometry that I didn't spot, ask me and I'll post my zbrush version asap.
and the teeth just look they have been placed in. Like fake teeth
Things that need some work:
I haven't worked on the eyebrow enough. I'll probably redo them completely. (Right now they almost give a constipated look. Almost.)
Rework the nose a bit.
Rework a bit of the general geometry (mainly the forehead)
Hair doesn't look equal on both side of his head. Will work on this.
The teeth still need a LOT of work (it's probably what need it the most atm), both in shape and in texture, as the teeth looks fake.
Adjust lips/gums color. Will be changed at the same time I change the teeth.
Adjust the mustache area (with a more desaturated color instead of skin-pink).
The general texture seems "cheap" on certain area. Will adjust that.
What changed:
Added much more emotion to the character.
Used real-life picture references to correct the general geometry.
Mouth position (and lips, which are far from done, but already have a better shape)
Adjusted the symmetry. When I flipped the project in photoshop, there was many things that didn't work. Tried to correct most of them, but some mistakes might've slipped in (wouldn't be surprised if a few did, actually).
If something is weird and need correction on the facial geometry that I didn't spot, ask me and I'll post my zbrush version asap.