[WIP] Female Cable
polycounter lvl 8
Hi, folks. I'm a long time lurker, but I'm starting to get the ball rolling my character art portfolio so it's about time I start posting some art and get some feedback. First up, I've decided to make a character model based on one of my favorite Marvel characters, Cable.
I put together this ref/inspiration map to help me get started/motivated:
I started of by drawing this laughable concept:
Then, I went back to the drawing board. Haha, get it...:poly142:
Still, not great. But I'm working on my anatomy and 2d skills as well. So everything in a work in progress. This basically gave me what I need to see where I wanted to go, so I moved on to creating the base mesh. Here's where I'm at:
My plan is to sculpt from here. I've been trying to pay attention to all of the helpful threads on here, and pay attention to everyone's advice to others. So the plan is, detailed nudie-mesh>block in details(pouches, etc.)>hi-poly sculpt eveything>low-poly retopo>unwrap and texture. I think I may have screwed up a bit already though, as I got ahead of myself with the base mesh. You can probably see in the wires that the topology is probably not suited well for sculpting. But I'm still learning, so this is the first of many. Gimme what you got, I like big crits and I cannot lie.
I put together this ref/inspiration map to help me get started/motivated:
I started of by drawing this laughable concept:
Then, I went back to the drawing board. Haha, get it...:poly142:
Still, not great. But I'm working on my anatomy and 2d skills as well. So everything in a work in progress. This basically gave me what I need to see where I wanted to go, so I moved on to creating the base mesh. Here's where I'm at:
My plan is to sculpt from here. I've been trying to pay attention to all of the helpful threads on here, and pay attention to everyone's advice to others. So the plan is, detailed nudie-mesh>block in details(pouches, etc.)>hi-poly sculpt eveything>low-poly retopo>unwrap and texture. I think I may have screwed up a bit already though, as I got ahead of myself with the base mesh. You can probably see in the wires that the topology is probably not suited well for sculpting. But I'm still learning, so this is the first of many. Gimme what you got, I like big crits and I cannot lie.
Replies
This model looks like that pioroberson character. I would say that it is a good start for sculpt, the topology looks fine.
From your drawings looks like you need some extra learning from proportion and anatomy, so my advice would be:
-Start sculpting this model with low sobdvisions and try to get a nice body proportion before anything else. From your concept the body proportion doesn´t help much, gather some female model around to be your goal. Use move and push/pull around those vertices untill you get the proportion you want.
I hope that makes sense
My worry was that, there are a few sections where the quads are small or large and there are a few 5 and 3 sided polys. I tried to avoid that as much as possible and make sure that the quads were all fairly close in size. This is my first time using this sort of workflow, so I'm still learning.
My plan is to adjust the proportions of the model at a low sub-division level until it's golden, and then go from there. I'll give that a shot as soon as I get back in front of my computer.
Also, I'm more concerned with learning and improving my 3d, so the reasoning behind my subject isn't my main concern. Just something I wanted to do.
That said, I don't know who Cable is, only what he looks like, and looking at the models currently, I can honestly say, as a layman, I would have never figured out that was a Cable persona, let alone a rule 63 version of him.
Body definition in form (hulking wise or even muscular lady in builder series) isn't there, the current suit looks alot like what Pheonix, Storm, or any other of the ladies from X-Men should be wearing, and alot of the details have been moved around in really sexualized places (example, the chest strap should over the cleavage, or if you want, both over and under, also bags need to looks like bags, not mini Batbelts, the current getup looks more like something to 'bump' up her breast rather then be a strap with tools inside).
Now keep in mind this is the assumption that you will be following the design from the sketch you made, so I'm currently talking out of my ass this early, just stuff to keep on mind down the line.
Also, take care with the face, Cable isn't young, and from the ref images you have stacked, all the girls look like they belong in their mid 20 at most.
I was anxious to get feedback on my base mesh, but I probably should have waited until I had more to show to post. I'm really trying to better my 2d skills as well as my 3d skills, but I didn't want to spend too much time drawing this one, because it was intended to be a quick project to get some experience with a decent workflow and get ball rolling on some decent portfolio pieces. I don't want to get hung up too much on the "why" behind my idea. I'd rather get hung up on my technical snafus and learn from them, than get into a argument about comic book characters, which aren't always 100% consistent to begin with.
That said though, I did take all of what you said into consideration before I drew that concept though. I lacked the skills to render any of that, but my inspiration folder for this project actually consists of
~30% Big Boss from MGS - both older and a soldier
~30% Female bodybuilders
~40% Cable and Marvel females (both older and young)
When I was trying to decide where the "chest" strap should go, I originally considered running it straight across her breasts, but I imagined that would be pretty uncomfortable. These pictures gave me the idea to put it where I did:
Over and under, like you said. I just didn't think it would look right.
I'll update soon, with the first sculpt pass. Going to be taking what everyone said into consideration when I'm nailing down the proportions and what not.
While I realize you don't want to create a "butch" looking female Cable, the one thing you can't lose is his no-nonsense/leader demeanor. Up until this point, the poses you've chosen and the proportions of your model indicate a young/flirty character.
You're still very early in the project, so you may already have plans to fix things, so just be aware of the issues as you progress.
if you want your girl to look even remotely like a marvel girl, then this is already a bad start unfortunately.
This was my first legit model and my main purpose was to learn some things, including workflow and technique. I learned quite a bit and see where things can be significantly improved on my future models. Please, by all means, crit away. I am done with this one though, so I'm moving on to the next one.
you're missing all of the key lines that they use in their character styling. you're missing the cutesy anime style face, and big bold hair shapes. i'm sorry if this comes off as harsh, but at this point the only thing defining her as female is a round ass and sucked in hips.
you need to really study this kind of thing, draw women, lots of them. draw the style you're aiming for, draw the faces, draw the eyes, draw the curves, draw it all, and draw it a lot. because that's what's truly lacking. your texture work could be improved on, sure. but the best texture in the world wouldn't have made this piece stand out at all, because it's lacking the fundamental points of the styles you're trying to emulate, from all standpoints.
it doesn't match the marvel style
it doesn't match the bishoujo style
it doesn't match a natural style
pick one, study it, and then come back and nail it.
This impression is also strengthened by the poor material definition in the textures, as mentioned. There's no real difference between the skin, hair, metal arm, and whatever material the bodysuit, straps and boots are supposed to be made out of. Well, not that it makes it look like a real-life costume (it just looks unrealistic), but it gives her whole outfit a feeling of half-assedness when it should be really eye-popping. As far as other technical things go, your UV map leaves a lot to be desired - tons of wasted space, and seemingly very uneven texel density - and while it's very hard to tell from that "wireframe" shot, it looks like you've spent a huge chunk of polys on her hair that don't necessarily do much. And on a related note, you should always be listing the triangle count, and not the polygon count, since polygons technically can be made of any number of triangles/vertices, non-triangle polygon count isn't necessarily all that informative. (Maybe the name of this site is creating bad habits in many beginner modelers :P)
I too would like to commend you for completing the model, even if it still has a lot of room for improvement. That's more than I seem to be able to, most of the time. :P But I think the number one thing you should learn from this, and you should really spend some time and effort thinking about for your next model, is the concept. Easily the number one thing holding this model back is the lack of a clear concept going in.
Of course, there are skilled 3D artists who aren't very good at drawing, and as such have trouble communicating their ideas with a 2D concept, but in this case, judging from the final model there doesn't seem to have been more to the concept than what we saw in that drawing. It seems like the character's proportions is based more on the reference that made it easier for you to build a basemesh than what the actual character demands. Her face looks plain with no real distinctive feature or expression. As mentioned, there's no indication in the concept or the final model what material any part of the costume is made of.
Before rushing into modelling another character, you should really think a lot about these things and try to develop a strong concept first. Don't be afraid to spend a little more time on the concept phase, try to get some feedback on it and make sure you have a rock solid foundation before diving in.
@almighty_gir - Thanks for the critique. I was being a bit sarcastic to be honest. :poly122: I am calling this one done though, not to say I can't revisit is later. I needed this exercise because I simply just didn't know how "it" worked. I turned from sitting in the dark, worshiping forum threads, having a massive inspiration folder, examining youtube videos, to sitting down and saying, "let's do this, and stop dreaming about it." I picked this subject out of a hat because I could have spent months just trying to decide what to make, but I needed to buck up and just make some damn art. So yeah, my next pieces will involve me exploring a style. This was just an exercise, and I wasn't emulating any style, just trying to find "aha" moments because I have NEVER done this properly before. I learned sooo much diving in, instead of watching. And I'm excited to take all of the things you've said into my future projects.
The hair was a complete experiment. I wanted to try it out, and it was wild. Definitely lots of wasted tris. I am going to sit down and try a zillion different hair techniques, and see what I like and what I can make dance.
The face was a disaster, but I went with it because I wanted to see if I could get any sort of detail out of it without a highly detailed sculpt. I wont cut that corner again, but I had to see for myself.
This is newbie question, but how do I display the triangle count in 3ds Max? Also, how do I display the triangles in the wireframe?
If you're still learning the menus and workflow trying to hit a certain style is just going to confuse you more.