First off, the sculpt looks really great! Nice work!
About the horse, I think it looks a bit too tacky, specially its legs. I don't think they fit with everything else. The head looks great, but as heboltz said, it doesn't look chinese. I feel that the helm will bring out the theme a lot more, but for now, while it looks great, I'm not sure if the whole chinese theme is coming through.
Thanks, I will try and make it less Greek/Roman if I can.
The collar was taken from Chinese style dresses, so I think it will probably be fine , right?
In a lot of the Chinese Armour I looked at they had lots of layers of cloth/leather/metal so I tried to use that idea by making lots of horizontal lines in the Armour. (The leather flap over the hand came from looking at this general reference too)
The horse I had some trouble with reference-wise which is probably why it doesn't feel right. I was trying to make a really aggressive strong looking horse to match LC's personality. but when I looked at reference I couldn't find too much that I liked so I mixed a few things.
Here are a few of my references:
I am not sure what i can do about the bracers. But maybe for the pauldrons I might try a straighter arc or two? I think I'll keep the under layers of it and try out a few different things for the top part.
I am thinking ill use a similar horse head for the ends of the flag poles later.
Thanks for the advice guys, confirmed a few suspicions for me. I hope I can turn this around
Well I have reworked my concept to try and push some more Chinese looking elements into the design. I am just hoping it wont take away from LC's distinct silhouette. (I think whatever I do with the flags will make a big part of that).
That is sort of why I didn't push the Chinese stuff too much to begin with, I couldn't find much reference for Chinese heavy armour. I ended up trying to do a very exaggerated version of Mulan's armour from the Disney film.
The rope stuff was an idea from exaggerating this kind of stuff:
Is it not Chinese?
If anyone had better reference or any suggestions for me I would be very grateful if they shared it with me. I am pretty stuck if this isn't seeming apprpriate.
That is sort of why I didn't push the Chinese stuff too much to begin with, I couldn't find much reference for Chinese heavy armour. I ended up trying to do a very exaggerated version of Mulan's armour from the Disney film.
The rope stuff was an idea from exaggerating this kind of stuff:
Is it not Chinese?
If anyone had better reference or any suggestions for me I would be very grateful if they shared it with me. I am pretty stuck if this isn't seeming apprpriate.
that rope stuff called 中国结 / chinese knotting. they use for decorative. absolutely not related with rope.
talk about rope (thick one), Japanese got use it most of the time related with shine/ temple... so you can see usually it serve as seal of divine from ghost / demon (whatever it called)... you even can see lotsa design in Lara Croft game... the island of yamatai bla bla bla...
as for chinese influence armor, maybe you can try "monkey king" (son goku) for reference. i notice chinse armor in fantasy one usually use thinner rope, or it should called thread, in red colour. or use cloth for binding stuff. like how you did on your blade...
well that's is my personal opinion
it might be wrong information too...
actually previous version of the LC design i think is enough for chinse feel, just after you switch to thicker rope, it feels more japanese.
@agito666: Thanks, you have given me a lot to think about. I am a little stuck with what to do now seeing as I have some conflicting opinions. I just need to either commit to something that is incorrect or gather the energy to redesign again... :'C
If I do manage to find the time to redesign I might looks a little at this:
I am just not sure if thin red threads will really be anything more than noise in game view.
@agito666: Thanks, you have given me a lot to think about. I am a little stuck with what to do now seeing as I have some conflicting opinions. I just need to either commit to something that is incorrect or gather the energy to redesign again... :'C
If I do manage to find the time to redesign I might looks a little at this:
I am just not sure if thin red threads will really be anything more than noise in game view.
use braid then will be more suitable it think, better avoid that Japan rope design or else really can divert people think that is japanese design. well at least for me.
Hey guys, I decided to keep working with what I had because I had some other commitments and felt I didn't have the time to rework.
I have spent a couple of hours trying to solve this little problem though.
Sorry the image is so small but I cant get a bigger one of the problem.
Basically I symmetrically mapped the banners on LC's back and they are producing a seam along the symmetry line. I have tried everything that I can think of to find the source of the problem including:
Providing ample padding
Using flat normals
Using flat colour in the diffuse map
Including an opacity channel set to 100%
The issue disappears as I bring the camera closer to the model, which is why I thought it was a padding issue but seeing as it persists against flat colour, flat normals I am at a complete loss.
Working on this Wraith King weapon for the February competition:
Really trying to get a grip on the basics of sculpting. I might rework the surface details and figure out something a little different for the 'tongue' and pommel.
I am experimenting with baking a little bit. I don't usually use intersecting geometry but I thought I might give it a go this time. Unfortunately the 'teeth' look awful this way so I am going to have to rethink how I am going about this. Any suggestions would be great.
I really like the sword so far. I'm just not really getting that green teeth. I don't think that it fits the rest of the sword. Apart from that, I think that the rest is really really solid!
Thanks for the feedback, it is really appreciated.
I am really glad you like it ^_^
Some of the green I painted to fake the glow from the tongue and some of it is probably the rim light. I will go through and see if I can get some of the green out by putting some warmer colours on the teeth.
EDIT: Unless you meant remove the teeth altogether? if so I can look into doing that instead.
Ooooh, it's a tongue! That was the problem I was having, it looks a bit out of place and hard to tell what it is. I think that you could try to make it a bit more obvious that it's a tongue, since it looks like a teeth or something, specially because it looks like it's too flat. Now I can definitely see a tongue there, but it's not something you get from the first glance.
maybe due to most of the monster sword don't have tongue design on that, or normally they'd make it more flesh-ish design for the sword. but your case is more metal/ rock texture 's non-organic looks so normally better with teeth on the sword.
I have done a few paint overs to try and figure out a way of fixing it, but all of them would basically require me to remodel. I wish I had thought of this issue while I was in the concept stage but I don't really feel like revising that much. I will see what I can do with different materials but I'd rather be modelling something else than remaking this one.
I don't think it is a strong enough concept (especially when compared to some of the others in the feb competition). Instead I will be moving on to work on fleshing out some new ideas. Like the beginning of this warlock idea:
The concept is that warlock has gotten himself into some dark magic that he cant handle and it has corrupted his body. The weapon and offhand things will cover his hands to make him appear to have corrupted flesh. Lots of thorny bits and tentacles too.
Another concept. Warlock, Axe and Disruptor are all Oglodi and I thought I could try and give them a similarly themed weapon each as a bundle. I might have another pass at them to see if I can get them a bit better.
Another concept. Warlock, Axe and Disruptor are all Oglodi and I thought I could try and give them a similarly themed weapon each as a bundle. I might have another pass at them to see if I can get them a bit better.
It all made sense after I realised. :P
Excuse me for being a little slow. I will try and keep up.
(I really enjoy the comics and stuff you do for Dota on Deviant Art)
hehe thanks, i somehow like to draw those stuff to troll in internet. or express my anger as a support in comic XD
side note, i hope this forum can revamp all smiley icon like my local forum do
I have been watching some videos by some of the amazing creators here who are kind enough to show their process. I am planning on making a few big changes to how I have been working.
Hey Ghost, I made the edges a little blunt because Centaur gets around satung 'A dull blade, but heavy'. I know the concept looked sharper. Ill have a look at rebaking it with sharper edges and see which I prefer.
The white bake? You mean the AO? I did it in xnormal.
What is on that model is an AO, Blue channel of the normal map, a gradient map that i make by baking a uvw planar onto the uvw unwrap coordinates, Green channe l of hte object space normal map, edge map.
All on a grey background for now. I don't think it is too much out of the ordinary? Is there something I could be doing better?
Sukotto: Thank you . Also thanks for the heads up on the handle. I have adjusted it so it looks a little more comfortable.
Cagdas: Yeah it is all baked in xnormal. Just for a quick and easy solution.
I convert the object-space to tangent-space normals with handplane though.
And there are a few ways of getting the edge map, but it is extracted from the normal map.
Been fiddling away with the masks. I should have something close to finished fairly soon.
I've not encountered the term 'white bake' but that isn't saying much as I don't have a huge amount of experience.
In that screenshot I have:
Mask1 & Mask2 turned off/default black or white
Normal map
Diffuse map made from
-An edge map set to overlay.
-Green channel of the object-space normal map
-A gradient map set to overlay
-The blue channel of the tangent-space normal map set to multiply
-Ambient Occlusion map (this is what I am assuming that you call a white bake) set to multiply
-A dark grey base layer
All of this comes from xnormal bakes originally. xnormal is really quick and easy. Other artists get better results in other programs but for me the simplicity wins me over for now.
I think a fair few people do something similar and often use point-light maps too. I change the way I do it from item to item, I am just trying to find a way that i like the most. I have a few issues with the way that I am doing it at the moment and hope to get a better process.
Diffuse map made from
-An edge map set to overlay.
-Green channel of the object-space normal map
-A gradient map set to overlay
-The blue channel of the tangent-space normal map set to multiply
-Ambient Occlusion map (this is what I am assuming that you call a white bake) set to multiply
-A dark grey base layer
"-Green channel of the object-space normal map "
Multiply blend mode?
Can you show me what your gradient map looks like? I've never used them, that's probably why my diffuse looks so bleak.
I vary how I use the maps depending on what looks right. I think I usually use Overlay for that layer. But it is basically always a combination of overlay and multiply for all the baked maps.
Here is my gradient map at actual size, I bake everything at 4x
Excuse the sub-par unwrapping.
I use max for this map.
I get the mesh that I want a gradient on and unwrap it.
(Set map channel to 1)
Apply a gradient to it.
On top of the stack I use a UVW Map modifier set to Planar.
Align it so that it is bright at the top, dark at the bottom.
(Set map channel to 2)
Then I hit '0' for the RTT menu.
In the mapping coordinates set to 'existing channel' and chose '1'
Add a diffuse map to the output. (note the output location)
Hit render. Go look at the output file (ignore the display one you see in max)
Done.
It is pretty fast to do, but there is a script linked on the front page of Polycount that will probably do the job faster. I have not used it.
I think I'm almost done with the Axe weapon, time to move on to the others. I am trying a few new things in my workflow and I'm still trying to iron out a few things so I might revise this one when I'm done with the other 2
Replies
Trying to think a little outside of weapons for my next one. Considering some springtime hair for Crystal Maiden.
Will do some higher resolution images with different angles if I decide to make this.
I am also bringing together some ideas for a Chinese centaur...
With this I have tried to mix Chinese style with LC/Dota existing style.
I'm still working on the bracers but I would be thankful for any advice on my current direction.
Also: A huge thanks to Spudnikfor the concept sheets. Saved me a lot of fiddling about.
Been doing a little bit of zbrush stuff. I find it a little intimidating to go too crazy with it.
Any advice on where I am going with this would be great.
My main concerns are:
Is the spring2014 theme being represented enough in the concept?
Is the horse working?
Any other suggestions would be great too
What are the references you are working off?
Maybe making the pauldrons a little bit larger and exaggerated would boost the silhouette to cool maximums.
About the horse, I think it looks a bit too tacky, specially its legs. I don't think they fit with everything else. The head looks great, but as heboltz said, it doesn't look chinese. I feel that the helm will bring out the theme a lot more, but for now, while it looks great, I'm not sure if the whole chinese theme is coming through.
The collar was taken from Chinese style dresses, so I think it will probably be fine , right?
In a lot of the Chinese Armour I looked at they had lots of layers of cloth/leather/metal so I tried to use that idea by making lots of horizontal lines in the Armour. (The leather flap over the hand came from looking at this general reference too)
The horse I had some trouble with reference-wise which is probably why it doesn't feel right. I was trying to make a really aggressive strong looking horse to match LC's personality. but when I looked at reference I couldn't find too much that I liked so I mixed a few things.
Here are a few of my references:
I am not sure what i can do about the bracers. But maybe for the pauldrons I might try a straighter arc or two? I think I'll keep the under layers of it and try out a few different things for the top part.
I am thinking ill use a similar horse head for the ends of the flag poles later.
Thanks for the advice guys, confirmed a few suspicions for me. I hope I can turn this around
I hope this is feeling a little more Chinese :S
even i'm not that sure but rope design really makes me feel japanese much, blame naruto and street fighter Akuma or Gouken. :P
The rope stuff was an idea from exaggerating this kind of stuff:
Is it not Chinese?
If anyone had better reference or any suggestions for me I would be very grateful if they shared it with me. I am pretty stuck if this isn't seeming apprpriate.
that rope stuff called 中国结 / chinese knotting. they use for decorative. absolutely not related with rope.
talk about rope (thick one), Japanese got use it most of the time related with shine/ temple... so you can see usually it serve as seal of divine from ghost / demon (whatever it called)... you even can see lotsa design in Lara Croft game... the island of yamatai bla bla bla...
as for chinese influence armor, maybe you can try "monkey king" (son goku) for reference. i notice chinse armor in fantasy one usually use thinner rope, or it should called thread, in red colour. or use cloth for binding stuff. like how you did on your blade...
well that's is my personal opinion
it might be wrong information too...
actually previous version of the LC design i think is enough for chinse feel, just after you switch to thicker rope, it feels more japanese.
If I do manage to find the time to redesign I might looks a little at this:
I am just not sure if thin red threads will really be anything more than noise in game view.
use braid then will be more suitable it think, better avoid that Japan rope design or else really can divert people think that is japanese design. well at least for me.
I have spent a couple of hours trying to solve this little problem though.
Sorry the image is so small but I cant get a bigger one of the problem.
Basically I symmetrically mapped the banners on LC's back and they are producing a seam along the symmetry line. I have tried everything that I can think of to find the source of the problem including:
Providing ample padding
Using flat normals
Using flat colour in the diffuse map
Including an opacity channel set to 100%
The issue disappears as I bring the camera closer to the model, which is why I thought it was a padding issue but seeing as it persists against flat colour, flat normals I am at a complete loss.
Any help would be fantastic.
It has been a great experience making it. I have a huge list of things to do better next time.
http://steamcommunity.com/workshop/filedetails/?id=216813769
Thanks to everyone who gave me feedback ^_^
Mainly trying to figure out how it will fly for the moment.
It is supposed to be somewhat Venomancer themed so I might add some more spikes and blistery things to it.
Really trying to get a grip on the basics of sculpting. I might rework the surface details and figure out something a little different for the 'tongue' and pommel.
I am experimenting with baking a little bit. I don't usually use intersecting geometry but I thought I might give it a go this time. Unfortunately the 'teeth' look awful this way so I am going to have to rethink how I am going about this. Any suggestions would be great.
Any suggestions would be great.
I am really glad you like it ^_^
Some of the green I painted to fake the glow from the tongue and some of it is probably the rim light. I will go through and see if I can get some of the green out by putting some warmer colours on the teeth.
EDIT: Unless you meant remove the teeth altogether? if so I can look into doing that instead.
well i think so :P
I have done a few paint overs to try and figure out a way of fixing it, but all of them would basically require me to remodel. I wish I had thought of this issue while I was in the concept stage but I don't really feel like revising that much. I will see what I can do with different materials but I'd rather be modelling something else than remaking this one.
I don't think it is a strong enough concept (especially when compared to some of the others in the feb competition). Instead I will be moving on to work on fleshing out some new ideas. Like the beginning of this warlock idea:
The concept is that warlock has gotten himself into some dark magic that he cant handle and it has corrupted his body. The weapon and offhand things will cover his hands to make him appear to have corrupted flesh. Lots of thorny bits and tentacles too.
Here is something I did this afternoon for Centaur. I was thinking of making a whole set, but I might stick to single items for a while.
Any crit would be great.
*put on McDonald cap*
"Sir, you want large, medium or small set meal ?"
I am a little unsure about your comment.
Do you mean that it looks like McDonalds packaging?
Because I've googled the packaging and I cant really see the similarity...
Or that it looks like other work?
or something else..?
Regardless I will see if I can find a way of removing any association with McDonalds.
Thanks for having a look at my thread guys
(and thanks for dealing with my apparent lack of humor :'C)
it is a joke
sorry to make you confused.
that is a joke about big,medium, small set meal... or coffee you can see from starbuck, coffee bean, etc franchise.
It all made sense after I realised. :P
Excuse me for being a little slow. I will try and keep up.
(I really enjoy the comics and stuff you do for Dota on Deviant Art)
hehe thanks, i somehow like to draw those stuff to troll in internet. or express my anger as a support in comic XD
side note, i hope this forum can revamp all smiley icon like my local forum do
I have been watching some videos by some of the amazing creators here who are kind enough to show their process. I am planning on making a few big changes to how I have been working.
The white bake? You mean the AO? I did it in xnormal.
What is on that model is an AO, Blue channel of the normal map, a gradient map that i make by baking a uvw planar onto the uvw unwrap coordinates, Green channe l of hte object space normal map, edge map.
All on a grey background for now. I don't think it is too much out of the ordinary? Is there something I could be doing better?
Cagdas: Yeah it is all baked in xnormal. Just for a quick and easy solution.
I convert the object-space to tangent-space normals with handplane though.
And there are a few ways of getting the edge map, but it is extracted from the normal map.
Been fiddling away with the masks. I should have something close to finished fairly soon.
In that screenshot I have:
Mask1 & Mask2 turned off/default black or white
Normal map
Diffuse map made from
-An edge map set to overlay.
-Green channel of the object-space normal map
-A gradient map set to overlay
-The blue channel of the tangent-space normal map set to multiply
-Ambient Occlusion map (this is what I am assuming that you call a white bake) set to multiply
-A dark grey base layer
All of this comes from xnormal bakes originally. xnormal is really quick and easy. Other artists get better results in other programs but for me the simplicity wins me over for now.
I think a fair few people do something similar and often use point-light maps too. I change the way I do it from item to item, I am just trying to find a way that i like the most. I have a few issues with the way that I am doing it at the moment and hope to get a better process.
"-Green channel of the object-space normal map "
Multiply blend mode?
Can you show me what your gradient map looks like? I've never used them, that's probably why my diffuse looks so bleak.
I vary how I use the maps depending on what looks right. I think I usually use Overlay for that layer. But it is basically always a combination of overlay and multiply for all the baked maps.
Here is my gradient map at actual size, I bake everything at 4x
Excuse the sub-par unwrapping.
I use max for this map.
I get the mesh that I want a gradient on and unwrap it.
(Set map channel to 1)
Apply a gradient to it.
On top of the stack I use a UVW Map modifier set to Planar.
Align it so that it is bright at the top, dark at the bottom.
(Set map channel to 2)
Then I hit '0' for the RTT menu.
In the mapping coordinates set to 'existing channel' and chose '1'
Add a diffuse map to the output. (note the output location)
Hit render. Go look at the output file (ignore the display one you see in max)
Done.
It is pretty fast to do, but there is a script linked on the front page of Polycount that will probably do the job faster. I have not used it.
And laughed for a good minute or three about the implied sarcasm etc. She loves your display picture.
An update on that Axe axe.
Hoping I have not overdone the battle wear.