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A new modeling tool released

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  • Michael Knubben
    3dtoons: the default for sliding seperate elements is V MMB, I believe. not the best hotkey, but I haven't really figured out for myself where I want it yet, either.
  • 3dtoons
    MightyPea! Thank you! That's it!

    As for the Graphic UI vs Hot-Key debate. I occasionally do freelance character modeling. My time outside of my day-job is precious to me and my family, so any time spent freelancing needs to be short and quick for it to be worth my time. I usually get paid by the character, so the faster I can bust it out, the more I can make per hour, and the more time I get to spend NOT freelancing.

    So to me, a graphical UI might look nice, and speed up the learning process of the program, but in the end, clicking on UI buttons over and over and over again is SLOW. Hot-keying streamline tools is lightning fast! Sure, your learning process might be slower, but the speed you gain after you have learned the program will easily make up for it. The speed of a modeling program is all about minimizing key-strokes, mouse movement, and mouse clicks. The less of those you have, the faster the program! That's exactly what the streamline tools are there for... speed!
  • passerby
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    passerby polycounter lvl 12
    you will never please everyone with the hotkey vs UI thing.
    kinda arguing a familiar is better here, when that isn't true in all cases.

    VW isn't hte only app to take this to extremes also.

    take a look at a code editor like VIM, works way differnlty than most would expect, but since i got over the learning curve and bent it to my will, i work much much faster in it compared to a other IDE or code editor.
  • IStonia
    3dtoons wrote: »
    Hey IStonia,

    I tried all of your suggestions. Some work great, and others I still don't understand. Thanks for taking the time to walk me through it.

    I made a mistake explaining that I couldn't assign a key to the MMB in order to toggle the display. I meant the MMWheel, not the actual depressing of the MMB. I don't see the MMW available in the hotkey assignment dropdown. I would like to be able to roll the wheel forward and backward while holding ctrl + alt to roll through the display of an object (like Silo). I would also like to assign the MMW+Shift to increase or decrease the soft selection percentage. And lastly, I would like to assign MMW+Ctrl+Shift to relax selection. Is that possible?

    Lastly... I still can't figure out how to slide a partial loop. I can either slide one edge, or the whole loop, but not a partial loop (more than one edge). The default Streamline Hot-Key I'm using is "G", which is Loop Select/Slide Edges. If I don't have an edge selected and hit "G", it will slide the single edge I'm hovering over (which is cool). If I have one or more edge selected and hit "G", it selects the whole loop, then allows me to slide (also cool). BUT... what if I don't want to select the whole loop first? I just want it to slide what edges I have selected. How do I do that? My suggestion is to remove the Select Loop from the Slide functionality of the G key? I know selecting a loop and sliding is super speedy, which is great, but I think I would rather double-click the loop, then slide it so I can have the partial-loop-slide functionality... unless I'm missing something.

    -3Dtoons


    V + MMB is a general slide tool. You can also use G + RMB to slide partial loop. Press G, RMB click the first edge, move cursor to another edge and RMB click and hold then drag.

    StreamLine tools have WMB-Up and WMB-Down events. You can assign the display loop command to either of these events.
  • GregD3
    Is there a way to change the SmartTips popup colors/transparency?
    And the radial menu transparency?
  • 3dtoons
    So... I think IStonia recently added Silo-like re-calculate symmetry that doesn't cut and re-weld the mesh. Where is that command located, and does it work on separate mesh islands that aren't connected in the middle (like a pair of boots)? I want to be able to select any symmetrical mesh and just hit "calculate symmetry". I swear I've found it before. I can't seem to find it now.

    Oh, I'm able to get the "calculate symmetry from two vertices" working on meshes that have a center line. I guess I'm wondering how to get symmetry if there isn't a center line.

    Thanks!
  • IStonia
    GregD3 wrote: »
    Is there a way to change the SmartTips popup colors/transparency?
    And the radial menu transparency?

    It is not possible to change SmartTips transparency. But it is possible for the others.


    3dtoons: Edge mode > Geometry > Calculate Symmetry Topologically. It is easier than the vertex method. Both can do symmetry calculation for meshes that have or have no center line. But in the last neweast updates, this function is broken so you have to use an older update.
  • IStonia
    new update.
    http://www.digitalfossils.com/Download/VoidWorld-Jul-05-12.rar

    Summary of changes:
    * Symmetry handling is improved. Center line restriction is removed. In previous updates, many operations can not be performed along symmetry center line. They can now.
    * Symmetry Calculation did not work in last two updates. It is fixed.
    * some bugs in Object/Mesh pivot operation are fixed.
    * A new streamline tool option. Edit > Customize > StreamLine Tools > Allow Event Action On Highlighted. It allows the program not to perform operation triggered by tool event on highlighted subobjects when this is no selection.
    * Edit > Customize > StreamLine Tools > Copy/Past. It is a quick way to move tool settings from one tool to another.
    * Some bugs in Retopo tools are found and fixed.
    Thanks!
  • IStonia
    new update.
    http://www.digitalfossils.com/Download/VoidWorld-Jul-06-12.rar

    Summary of changes:
    * Two new basic streamline tools. Polygon_Extrude_Axis, Polygon_Extrude_Plane. Extrusion is moved along manipulator axis or plane base on curosr initial move direction or view anlge.
    * Subobject mode > Geometry > Common Commands n Tools > Align, is improved. Snapping can be used to define alignment offset or radius.
    * Geometry > Calculate Symmetry Topologically. It works in all modes. The program will look for edge selection as a calculation clue first. One or two selected edges are required. If that failed, the program will automatically search a center polygon or center edge base on selected symmetry axis and do the calculation.
    Thanks!
  • IStonia
    new update.
    http://www.digitalfossils.com/Download/VoidWorld-Jul-07-12.rar

    Summary of changes:
    * 'Relax Selection' tool has a new option. If streamline tool option hotkey(default: Space) is pressed while performing this operation through a streamline tool, the relax strength will be decreased to 0.25.
    * Subobject mode > Geometry > Common Commands n Tools > Lay On. Align object base on subobject snapping. Select the first subobject, select the second subobject, then exceute this command. If the second subobject is missing, highlighted subobject will be used.
    Thanks!
  • IStonia
    new update.
    http://www.digitalfossils.com/Download/VoidWorld-Jul-08-12.rar

    Summary of changes:
    * 'Subobject mode > Geometry > Common Commands n Tools > Lay On' tool's orientation is corrected.
    Thanks!
  • 3dtoons
    IStonia: Thank you very much for adding the symmetry by topology command! It has been working very well, even with meshes that have partial asymmetry in them.

    Also, thanks for the relax option! I still need to adjust my hotkeys to try it, but it sounds like a great "finer detail" adjustment that I'm looking for.

    I've been trying to use Nvil for an actual production piece. So far so good. I'll be sure to let you know if I hit any show stoppers.

    You rock!
    -ShaneO
  • IStonia
    new update.
    http://www.digitalfossils.com/Download/VoidWorld-Jul-10-12.rar

    Summary of changes:
    * A bug in 'Boolean' tool is fixed.
    * A bug in edge 'Loop Insert' tool is fixed. It may cause crash or error.
    Thanks!
  • Tiles
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    Tiles greentooth
    May i renew my request to put the settings folder into the /appdata/roaming directory instead of the documents folder? It is disturbing :)

    Ah, forgot to ask, is there a way to save and load a custom UI layout? Means the colours and the arranged windows?
  • GregD3
    I'm having some issues with clipping. The viewport is acting like the object I'm working on is really small but it fills the entire grid area.

    See first attached image.

    Also when I rotate or move through the object, I get exploding polys.

    See last 2 attached images.
  • IStonia
    Tiles: I will move it to .../AppDate folder in the formal release. For now just leave it as is.

    GregD3: You can adjust the clip plane manually. Edit > Preference > Clip Plane.
    What kind of action have you performed to have polys exploded? You may have set this option on by accident, Edit > Options > Vertex Transform Along Edges.
  • Dataday
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    Dataday polycounter lvl 8
    Out of curiosity, what are the merits in using this application over the number of other applications on the market right now (both pay and for free)? I am just curious as to what sets it apart or why one would be interested in using it to begin with.

    =)
  • IStonia
    Dataday wrote: »
    Out of curiosity, what are the merits in using this application over the number of other applications on the market right now (both pay and for free)? I am just curious as to what sets it apart or why one would be interested in using it to begin with.

    =)

    I would say streamline work flow and customization are the two major things that makes this application different from other application. When I started this post, I have no these concepts at all. Since then I have lots feed back which makes me to turn the development direction into making it a fast program. Of course, solid tool sets are the foundation.
  • GregD3
    IStonia wrote: »
    GregD3: You can adjust the clip plane manually. Edit > Preference > Clip Plane.
    What kind of action have you performed to have polys exploded? You may have set this option on by accident, Edit > Options > Vertex Transform Along Edges.

    The clip plane and "exploding" polys only seem to happen when I have the current object selected. I'm not doing any kind of mesh editing, just moving the camera. It's hard to show with screenshots so here is a video that will hopefully help explain things more.
  • IStonia
    It works fine to me. You may have graphic card problem. All the renderings are handled by graphic card. Also the only thing makes it different between selected and unselected objects is the retopo state, Scene Explorer > Retopo Reference List > Retopo mode enalbed.
  • GregD3
    Thanks, unchecking the Retopo mode fixed it. Adjusting the Retopo Z offset fixes it also.
    So much better now. :)
  • Dataday
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    Dataday polycounter lvl 8
    IStonia wrote: »
    I would say streamline work flow and customization are the two major things that makes this application different from other application. When I started this post, I have no these concepts at all. Since then I have lots feed back which makes me to turn the development direction into making it a fast program. Of course, solid tool sets are the foundation.

    In all honestly, too many scripts and plug ins do the same thing for those primary applications we mostly rely on. That said I like what you are trying to do. More tools is never a bad thing, and hopefully some form of innovation can come from it.

    I havent used your application, so I am limited on the feedback I can give but from what I have seen, some applications have rose to prominence by not trying to compete with the same tools as other applications, but rather find out what the main applications struggle in and specialize in that one area.

    For example, 3D coat. People dont get it for its amazing sculpting ability, which i dont think it has, or its innovative approach to projection painting...but rather its ability to easily retopo a mesh (even with auto retopo) and then UV just as quickly.

    Those seem to be the hooks which attract artist and even some studios. Imagine modeling and having it autoUV, or a clever way to draw shapes (splines) in 2d and auto convert it into a 3d mesh (would be great for environment or prop art).

    In short find what people really need or hate doing in other apps and do it better or in a more innovative manner. This way your application can become part of someones set of tools while not actually replacing their primary 3d application.

    Also, have you considered working within Blender? It could use more talented developers and has already built up a huge following.

    This is all my opinion though and I hope it was helpful in one way or another. Keep up the good work =)


    Add: I tried out your app and it is quite impressive. Very clean.
  • IStonia
    DataDay, thanks for spending time trying the app!

    Not sure you have touched the streamline tools yet. It's the one that can give you speed and flexibility. I find that very often people either stopped by the Max like visual UI and miss this important part or they struggle to understand what streamline tool is.

    I use C# and Blender is written in C++. So I don't think I can work with Blender.
  • IStonia
    new update.
    http://www.digitalfossils.com/Download/VoidWorld-Jul-12-12.rar

    Summary of changes:
    * Edge mode > Geometry > Straighten Edges. Straighten selected edge lines.
    * Subobject mode > Selection > Select Similar Facing. Select subobjects which Face roughly in the same direction as the selected/hilighed subobject. The shreshold value can be adjusted.
    Thanks!
  • IStonia
    new update.
    http://www.digitalfossils.com/Download/VoidWorld-Jul-14-12.rar

    Summary of changes:
    * A bug in 'Space Loop' is fixed. Previously, if the number of vertices in a selected loop is over 20, the result will not be correct. Also a minor improvement on this tool. If selected edges are a closed loop, the vertex which is closest to viewport center will be used as spacing starting point.
    Thanks!
  • IStonia
    new update.
    http://www.digitalfossils.com/Download/VoidWorld-Jul-15-12.rar

    Summary of changes:
    * A bug in 'Space Loop' is fixed. It now works on selected open edges.
    Thanks!
  • IStonia
    new update.
    http://www.digitalfossils.com/Download/VoidWorld-Jul-16-12.rar

    Summary of changes:
    * Object scaling operation is improved.
    Thanks!
  • Michael Knubben
    I'm having another problem with the settings, they're just really not reliable at all. I try to move my settings over, and everything seems to work okay except for the Preferences. When I import my settings I can see colours change, but when I hit 'accept' it just goes back to the defaults.

    As for the new space-option in relax, what about just having it work like extrude/inset etc, and you drag the mouse while holding the key to go from o% to 100%? Same thing with spherise, and have it just apply the previously used settings when you click rather than drag.
  • ghib
    MightyPea wrote: »
    As for the new space-option in relax, what about just having it work like extrude/inset etc, and you drag the mouse while holding the key to go from o% to 100%? Same thing with spherise, and have it just apply the previously used settings when you click rather than drag.

    I totally agree with this; rather than scrubbing back and forth to relax the verts. I have a feeling also that this is scale dependent and the larger your object the harder you have to scrub for Relax to have any effect.
  • 3dtoons
    I'm up for anything that makes relax more user friendly. I use Relax all the time.

    The best relax function I've used with a stylus is a Smooth Brush system, sort of like Smooth in Zbrush, or Smooth in Maya. With a brush, the smooth amount is based on how hard you press with your stylus. I'm not requesting this for Nvil, I'm just saying it's nice.

    When I'm using a mouse, I prefer the Middle-Mouse Scroll Wheel. Although I'm open to other hotkey setups that use 0% to 100%. I like the idea of going from 0% to 100%, as long as I can go back and fourth to fine tune it.

    I would also like to see a function that averages all of the selected verts from 0% to 100% without relaxing the geometry's volume. Sort of like loop tidy, but over the surface of a broad area using verts instead of loops. Maybe this function already exists?

    Cheers,
    -ShaneO
  • ghib
    Actually, a set of brush based modelling tools would be a very welcome addition to Nvil at some point. I'm not talking about Zbrush or Mudbox killing performance or features of course but sometimes brush based modelling is much quicker and more efficient to use than traditional soft-selection based method.
    Really just a basic set of push/pull/smooth/nudge/flatten etc. within one tool.
  • IStonia
    new update.
    http://www.digitalfossils.com/Download/VoidWorld-Jul-18-12.rar

    Summary of changes:
    * A bug in preference setting importing is fixed.
    * Object mode > Selection > Select All Guide Line Objects.
    * Relex operation's strength control is changed. By default, the relax strength to be used is the default relax strength. But if streamline tool option hotkey(default: Space) is pressed while performing this operation through a streamline tool, the relax strength will be set as the value of cursor viewport horizontal position divided by virport width, and the default strength will also change to the strength being used.
    * Cylinder option is added to Align tool. Suobject mode > Geometry > Common Commands n Tools > Align.
    Thanks!

    MightyPea: The Relaxing process is different. There is no dead end position. Relax may go forever. And there is no way to relax back.

    3DToons: I need your feedback on the new relax weight control style.

    ghib: There are some sub tools in the vertex visual 'Tweak' tool which are similar to the ones you mentioned. What does 'Nudge' and 'Flatten' do?
  • IStonia
    new update.
    http://www.digitalfossils.com/Download/VoidWorld-Jul-20-12.rar

    Summary of changes:
    * A snapping bug in streamline translation tool is fixed.
    Thanks!
  • GregD3
    IStonia wrote: »
    There are some sub tools in the vertex visual 'Tweak' tool which are similar to the ones you mentioned. What does 'Nudge' and 'Flatten' do?

    I did not know those were there, they will definitely be used now. :thumbup:

    A couple ideas that I will try to explain and make sense: :)

    Push/pull would still be useful, although it is similar to the explode mode. But instead of pushing the vertices each in their own normal direction, push all the verts in the brush influence in a single averaged normal.

    Move: Duplicate the Pull mode, make it work just with verts via a brush like the other modes and call it Move (or grab or whatever sounds good).

    Flatten: (thinking out loud here, probably much better ways) calculate an average normal from all the verts within the brush influence (or optionally use the normal of the center-most vert within the brush). then calculate a plane that is perpendicular to that normal and position it so that its origin is the location of the center most vert within the brush influence (tangent plane of a point? not very good at geometry). then push/pull all other verts within the brush influence to the flatten plane using the plane's normal. :poly132: I don't know if that made sense.
  • 3dtoons
    IStonia: I gave the relax function a try this weekend. Honestly, I didn't notice a difference. I think it's because of the way I have relax set up. I will make another video for you.
    Thank you for working on making relax better though, I appreciate it!
    -ShaneO
  • IStonia
    new update.
    http://www.digitalfossils.com/Download/VoidWorld-Jul-26-12.rar

    Summary of changes:
    * New sub tools are added to vertex visual 'Tweak' tool.
    * A few more subobject basic streamline tools. Brush_Pull, Brush_Move...
    * 'Follow border shape' option is added to polygon 'Inset' tool.
    Thanks!
  • 3dnut
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    3dnut polycounter lvl 17
    Hi
    I get this error on running.

    Ok I plugged my headphones in and it now runs.
  • IStonia
    new update.
    http://www.digitalfossils.com/Download/VoidWorld-Jul-29-12.rar

    Summary of changes:
    * A snapping bug in Align -> Cylinder tool is fixed.
    Thanks!
  • GregD3
    IStonia wrote: »
    new update.
    http://www.digitalfossils.com/Download/VoidWorld-Jul-26-12.rar

    Summary of changes:
    * New sub tools are added to vertex visual 'Tweak' tool.
    * A few more subobject basic streamline tools. Brush_Pull, Brush_Move...
    * 'Follow border shape' option is added to polygon 'Inset' tool.
    Thanks!

    Awesome, thanks for the update!
    Using these a little more and I realize the way VW decides what verts are in the brush influence is unexpected. But the tweak tool is getting it right.
    http://youtu.be/2nYvjv-CN8Q
  • IStonia
    Something is wrong. When you change the tool to 'Move' or other tools rather than 'Tweak', your cursor should change to a line circle cursor instead of your blue one. And if you scroll WMB or click the 'Increase Brush Size+'/'Decrease Brush Sized-', the cursor size should change.
    You may have done some setting in your computer that fixes the cursor.
  • GregD3
    IStonia wrote: »
    Something is wrong. When you change the tool to 'Move' or other tools rather than 'Tweak', your cursor should change to a line circle cursor instead of your blue one. And if you scroll WMB or click the 'Increase Brush Size+'/'Decrease Brush Sized-', the cursor size should change.
    You may have done some setting in your computer that fixes the cursor.

    The screen recording software for some reason does not record the brush circle so I set a blue hilight to show where the center is. Everything draws correctly on the screen but CamStudio does not record it.

    The problem is that I can't modify with the brush the same verts as with the Tweak tool even though I'm placing the cursor in the same spot.
  • IStonia
    The Tweak tool is not a brush tool. It uses the normal soft selection.

    The brush has a depth so if the verts are too far away from brush they are out of influence.

    The brush position in view direction is decided by the vertex inside the brush that is closest to view camera.
    Mybe I can change it to the vertex which is closest to brush center. What do you think? worse or better? which is more predictable?
  • IStonia
    new update.
    http://www.digitalfossils.com/Download/VoidWorld-Jul-30-12.rar

    Summary of changes:
    * Some improvements on brush tools. Greg, the Tweak -> Move tools should be better now.
    Thanks!
  • Joltya
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    Joltya polycounter lvl 10
    Okay, I'm new here (and to 3DSMax) and I'm having a lot of issues with this nail gun:

    PICT0999.jpg

    1. How on earth am I supposed to get the trigger frame to morph into the handle??

    1.png

    2. How can I better topologize this? It's causing some pinching.

    2.png

    Here's a smooth of what I have so far:

    3.png

    I've been working on this thing for over 10 hours and have barely progressed and I feel awful now. :(
  • GregD3
    IStonia wrote: »
    new update.
    http://www.digitalfossils.com/Download/VoidWorld-Jul-30-12.rar

    Summary of changes:
    * Some improvements on brush tools. Greg, the Tweak -> Move tools should be better now.
    Thanks!

    Much better, thanks!

    A few suggestions:
    1. Add a center point in the brush circle to help with accuracy.
    2. Add 'shortcut key' + LMB + Horizontal brush movement to adjust brush size.
    3. Add 'shortcut key' + LMB + Vertical brush movement to adjust brush strength/weight.
    4. When the brush strength is being adjusted, draw a vertical bar showing the current weight. Brush center point (weight = 0) to the top of the brush circle (weight = 1).

    Is it possible to assign shortcut keys to subtools? for example, Tweak -> Move, Relax, Flatten, etc.
  • IStonia
    Greg: If you look back and check the Jul 26 update notes, you will see this
    *A few more subobject basic streamline tools. Brush_Pull, Brush_Move...
    That means you can setup a streamline tool to accomodate those brush tools. So I don't think it is necessary to create shortcut keys for the visual tools.
    You can adjust weight while using the streamline tool by pressing down and hold Space key and drag cursor. This message is available in the tool's description.
    The weight indication method you mentioned is not easy to imprement.


    JoltZero: I think you have made your post in a wrong thread.
  • GregD3
    Thanks, but I can't get the spacebar + drag cursor to work unless I'm activating a brush via a streamline shortcut.
    Could you add brush size adjustment to a space + vertical drag? It would be more tablet friendly.
    I don't really see a need for the weight indicator anymore now that I know about the numeric display, but a center point (or cross-hair cursor) would still be helpful if it's not too difficult to add.
  • IStonia
    new update.
    http://www.digitalfossils.com/Download/VoidWorld-Aug-01-12.rar

    Summary of changes:
    * In additional to scrolling WMB, new Brush size adjusting abilities is added to brush tools. Press down Space key before the tool is activated then drag vertically to adjust brush size once activated. Also '-' and '+' keys can do it.
    * A new basic streamline tool, Generic Tools > Brush Size.
    * A bug in vertex threshold welding is fixed.
    Thanks!
  • GregD3
    I'm probably missing something obvious but I can't figure out how to adjust the brush weight and size using the space key.

    If I activate the Vertex Tweak tool, select a brush, press the space bar and drag horizontally or vertically, nothing happens. I disabled the toggle viewport quad view with the space bar also.
    I also tried creating a streamline tool that activates a brush and space + drag still did not adjust size or weight.

    Now I could get the Brush Size tool to work with streamline, should there be a Brush Weight tool also?
  • IStonia
    The brush size and weight adjusting by space key is only available for streamline tools. It works. You have seen the numeric weight display before. Haven't you?
    You don't have to disabled the toggle viewport quad view with the space bar. My test setting is Ctrl+V+LMB. Make sure your are in vertex/edge/polygon mode. Ctrl+V+Space then LMB and drag.

    The brush size is a global value but weights are not. So you can't have a streamline weight tool.
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