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Modo 601

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interpolator
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Blaizer interpolator
Modo 601 is now available, go and see the new features!

http://www.luxology.com/

Yay! I've been using 302 for years, and at last, we have character rigs and animation!!!!

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  • EmAr
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    EmAr polycounter lvl 18
    If only I had the money. It's good to see they are beefing up Modo :)
  • Swizzle
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    Swizzle polycounter lvl 15
    This release is looking absolutely fantastic. I'm probably going to actually shell out for it later today.
  • CrazyMatt
    I feel very compelled to begin my learning for Modo since seeing this release yesterday. Looks like a very solid app and the rendering capabilities and the built in uv tools seem pretty great. As always the modeling tools and retopo as well.
  • Snefer
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    Snefer polycounter lvl 16
    Gave it a whirl today. Topology tools seems like its pretty damn badass... ALot of useful stuff in this update, more so than in 501 i'd say : ))
  • 3devo
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    3devo polycounter lvl 12
    a damnit knew this was in development but thought it was a ways off .oh well takes my monies luxology take them now now.
  • DrunkShaman
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    DrunkShaman polycounter lvl 14
    would you recommend it to create a quick base mesh for Zbrush and than importing it to Topology tool to re-topo than back to modo for UV layouts and texturing and than to blender for rigging and animation walk cycles?

    If so, than I think I should start saving for this, while practicing working with softimage xsi.
  • Snefer
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    Snefer polycounter lvl 16
    Nitewalkr: wait..WHAT :D
  • DrunkShaman
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    DrunkShaman polycounter lvl 14
    Snefer wrote: »
    Nitewalkr: wait..WHAT :D

    Nope, nope never mind, Found this:

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s-OsZqHp3to"]modo 601: Adding a skeleton to your mesh - YouTube[/ame]

    I havent seen the texturing in Modo nor rigging but this system is pretty convenient.

    If this product is as promising as it sounds than I can just buy this to start creating my portfolio and work on the small game projects that I have lined up (after doing a short term saving), and wait for the time when I have enough to buy Softimage XSI.

    EDIT: I think I can get started by just buying their Educational version of modo for a year. =\

    EDIT2: Nope, never mind I cant do that. I guess I can only save up and just buy the single license.

    Got over excited there for a moment. :(
  • Snowfly
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    Snowfly polycounter lvl 18
    Nice rigging tools, but what kind of interchange format is Alembic?
  • Muzzoid
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    Muzzoid polycounter lvl 10
    Man this just made modo a contender with the big boys. Im exited to try it out...
  • r_fletch_r
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    r_fletch_r polycounter lvl 9
    Muzz wrote: »
    Man this just made modo a contender with the big boys. Im exited to try it out...

    I really hope so. a little outside pressure for autodesk would be healthy.


    I notice there are bend and twist modifiers now. anyone tried using these for general modelling tasks, like you would with the stack in max.
  • lefix
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    lefix polycounter lvl 11
    i have tried out modo 201 or 301 long ago, and really loved it. but i eventually went back to max because it was a more completely package and i felt like with modo, i always needed a second 3d software to compliment it.
    so i am wondering, with skeletal animations, can modo 601 be considered a complete 3d package and a true rival to max/maya/xsi? or are there still fundamental things missing?
    i would love to switch to modo again. whatever new features they add, it seems like they do it better than everyone else
  • Ben Apuna
    @lefix:

    I think for games work it'll all come down to the FBX exporter. It was a bit messed up in 501 (with UDK at least). I hope they got it sorted out.
  • Rabbid_Cheeze
    Sounds like Modo has finally become a "complete" package, ready to compete with the old guard apps.

    Character rigging/animation and retopology sound great. It also looks like there is some sort of basic modifier-esk system in place like Max has. Too bad there's no demo yet, and wont be for about a month or two by the sounds of it.
  • Snefer
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    Snefer polycounter lvl 16
    It was? Im using the fbx-exporter all the time, and its working perfectly fine with UDK for me. Or do you mean with animation?
  • Maph
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    Maph polycounter lvl 8
    Coolness, we're still using good olde 402 at work. The addition to character animation might make it a good reason to upgrade.
    For those that have played with it, is it possible to export and re-use rigs?
  • Ben Apuna
    @Snefer:

    Yeah, I had some issues as did a few others with Modo -> Unity on the Luxology forums.

    http://www.polycount.com/forum/showthread.php?t=79254

    Maybe it was a UDK or Unity thing rather than a Modo issue which somehow got cleared up with time and updates. I haven't been keeping up with either UDK or Unity so I wouldn't know.
  • fattkid
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    fattkid polycounter lvl 15
    Not to sound like a fanboy or a marketing rep.....

    As a modeler in the games industry, I can say that after 4 solid years of using Max, 4 solid years of using Maya, and a few years of both together, I was sold on modo after using it for 3 months. It's my modeling, UVing and rendering tool of choice. And it get's better with every release.

    At work, quite a few artists have been interested in what app I'm using etc and why I use it, and after showing them why I like it, a few are learning up on it so they can switch over.

    It's a bit of a learning curve, as it does some things differently, or has different tools etc. But once you get it figured out, you really start to appreciate it. Even things at first I didn't like and wished it was like Max/Maya, I have since come to prefer.

    In my opinion, the real power of modo and they key to using it effectively is in customization. Once you understand all the tools, setting modo up with everything you need and want, right where you would like to have it, all the way down to the default settings on each tool (if you choose), you can focus 100% on the task at hand.

    I would also say that if you are the type that likes to "stay ahead of the curve" and is always looking to take your game/skill set to the next level, this would be a good tool add to your arsenal. Not just for what it can do now, but what it will be doing down the road.

    Anyway, a bit of a fanboy rant I suppose. I guess I'm still a little overly giddy about the 601 release :)
  • seven
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    seven polycounter lvl 13
    fattkid wrote: »
    Not to sound like a fanboy or a marketing rep.....

    As a modeler in the games industry, I can say that after 4 solid years of using Max, 4 solid years of using Maya, and a few years of both together, I was sold on modo after using it for 3 months. It's my modeling, UVing and rendering tool of choice. And it get's better with every release.

    At work, quite a few artists have been interested in what app I'm using etc and why I use it, and after showing them why I like it, a few are learning up on it so they can switch over.

    It's a bit of a learning curve, as it does some things differently, or has different tools etc. But once you get it figured out, you really start to appreciate it. Even things at first I didn't like and wished it was like Max/Maya, I have since come to prefer.

    In my opinion, the real power of modo and they key to using it effectively is in customization. Once you understand all the tools, setting modo up with everything you need and want, right where you would like to have it, all the way down to the default settings on each tool (if you choose), you can focus 100% on the task at hand.

    I would also say that if you are the type that likes to "stay ahead of the curve" and is always looking to take your game/skill set to the next level, this would be a good tool add to your arsenal. Not just for what it can do now, but what it will be doing down the road.

    Anyway, a bit of a fanboy rant I suppose. I guess I'm still a little overly giddy about the 601 release :)

    This.

    after 8 years of using Modo and also using Max and Maya professionally I prefer Modo hands down. This release really puts everything on the surface and makes this badboy well rounded.
    r_fletch_r wrote: »
    I notice there are bend and twist modifiers now. anyone tried using these for general modelling tasks, like you would with the stack in max.

    The bend and twist deformers have been in modo for quite some time but you haven't been able to stick them in a stack before now. I've used them in combination with fall offs when I've been modeling and have got some really satisfying results. Still waiting on construction history but the deformer stack is pretty powerful. You should check out Rich Hurrey doing a rig with deformers and it will demonstrate the deformation stack a bit.

    jump to about 4:30

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zdlz66Gmxq8"]modo 601: Special event - YouTube[/ame]
  • CrazyMatt
    Nice demo! I really like the topology tools there. Also those clouds were purty! :)
  • Slum
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    Slum polycounter lvl 18
    fattkid wrote: »
    Not to sound like a fanboy or a marketing rep.....

    As a modeler in the games industry, I can say that after 4 solid years of using Max, 4 solid years of using Maya, and a few years of both together, I was sold on modo after using it for 3 months. It's my modeling, UVing and rendering tool of choice. And it get's better with every release.

    At work, quite a few artists have been interested in what app I'm using etc and why I use it, and after showing them why I like it, a few are learning up on it so they can switch over.

    It's a bit of a learning curve, as it does some things differently, or has different tools etc. But once you get it figured out, you really start to appreciate it. Even things at first I didn't like and wished it was like Max/Maya, I have since come to prefer.

    In my opinion, the real power of modo and they key to using it effectively is in customization. Once you understand all the tools, setting modo up with everything you need and want, right where you would like to have it, all the way down to the default settings on each tool (if you choose), you can focus 100% on the task at hand.

    I would also say that if you are the type that likes to "stay ahead of the curve" and is always looking to take your game/skill set to the next level, this would be a good tool add to your arsenal. Not just for what it can do now, but what it will be doing down the road.

    Anyway, a bit of a fanboy rant I suppose. I guess I'm still a little overly giddy about the 601 release :)

    There's a reason why modo is used by id software :)

    (coming from a guy who has been using max for 10 years )
  • Pedro Amorim
    LOVE MODO!!

    wish i could use it at work :(
  • sulkyrobot
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    sulkyrobot triangle
    I'm currently learning the whole 3D thing with Maya just to get the lingo and basics down and there seems to be a ton more material for learning Maya. Once I've got that pinned down I'm definitely going to look into Modo601.

    Seems like it's really growing up quickly.
  • EtotheRic
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    EtotheRic polycounter lvl 18
    Wow, those rigging and IK features look really similar to what Mirai was doing, which is a great thing. I was reading you can also link morphs to joint rotation. I'll have to give this a try.
  • cptSwing
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    cptSwing polycounter lvl 11
    Man. I keep hearing good thigns about modo, and it seems that for most people character rigging and animation was the last big piece missing.

    Question for the modo users: how well integrated are modo's sculpting and painting tools, does it work as seamlessly as the pr suggests? do you use them?

    having all those things united in a single program is an exciting prospect.
  • pior
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    pior grand marshal polycounter
    Yeah, I have the same question as cptSwing. Is it possible to model something rough using regular polygon modelling, and then work on it at high subdivision levels using simple native Modo sculpting brushes ? Add, Smooth, Grab, Pinch, Flatten and Mask would be enough. Silo can somehow do that but it is way too unstable to be useful.

    I wouldn't necessarily need to be able to adjust the supporting flow of lvl 0, but that would be a huge plus too.

    [edit] Wait a minute ... they have a "try Modo" page but no trial download available ?? Way to shoot oneself in the foot ...
  • Emil Mujanovic
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    Emil Mujanovic polycounter lvl 18
    I used Modo 501 at my last studio job and I really wanted to love it, I really did. But it was missing a few key things that I use in Maya that took a lot of messing around to get to work in Modo (I would bitch to Pedro Amorim about this A LOT).
    The modeling tools were really nice and it was easy to get the hang of. I'll have to give 601 a go.
  • Blaizer
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    Blaizer interpolator
    Modo is quite good for subdivision modelling (just that), but as many of you already know, it hasn't got all the features we can find in max, such as the great amount of modifiers and tools (example: path deform).

    For sculpting like Zbrush the answer in a NO NO, and for painting, 501 sucks a lot, its tools are very very primitive and it gives me too many problems.

    Another thing is how modo handles the uvs. We have linear a smoothed uvs (included borders). Max and the other apps does not have this, and with the imported displacement maps from mudbox or Zbrush, all it's a headache.

    It's renderer it's fast and simple, and it CAN'T be compared with Vray or Mental Ray.

    One of the big points is that you can model with the sculpting tools and it makes the workflow faster than in any other software. You can work with a high detailed subdiv model like in Zbrush or Mudbox.

    I still use 302, i tried 401 & 501, and the perfomance in viewports fell down a lot. 301 offers the double of perfomance in viewports than 302 and i still don't understand that. I only hope to see that the new features don't bloat the app, making its load time slower and its perfomance more crappy than with 501.

    Like all apps, it has too many flaws, but for subdiv modelling it's the best app, and you don't need a quadro like with Max, in order to work well with subdivs with millions of polygons.

    I'm sure there will be a trial version soon :)
  • Snefer
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    Snefer polycounter lvl 16
    cptSwing and pior: Yes, they are fully integrated, great for just busting up and putting dents in hardsurface models. Stuff like just bringing up sculpting and then slightly smooth out a hard edge to get some varying hardness is great. The performance is not the best though, its not like zbrush, but yeah, for me it has removed zbrush from my workflow in many, many cases. Its also pretty nice because you can still use the regular modellingtools even if you are sculpting on something, for example if you realize you want more resolution in one particular spot you can just cut a few extra lines there and its done. I use the sculpting alot at work.
  • lefix
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    lefix polycounter lvl 11
    modo is like a super hot teenage girl where you cannot wait till she turns 18.
  • pior
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    pior grand marshal polycounter
    Blaizer : would you say that with 301, I could block in a mesh (500 tris), sculpt some stuff in at high resolution (simple brushing or grap to shape a cheekbone or a rough ear), then go back to the low and redirect my flow accordingly ? And leter on, go back to the high and refine (very roughly) with sculpting tools ?
  • CrazyMatt
    Pior, it sounds more than anything like a solid version of Silo when it comes to the sculpting and traditional model editing workflow when combining the two on the go.
  • Blaizer
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    Blaizer interpolator
    Pior, with modo we have a similar way to sculpt like in Zbrush, you put more levels in the subdiv, and you can add more detail, and then go to the lower level. But its perfomance it's pretty bad, and the worse, you see the patches...

    I use to model from a very basic low poly (boxes extruded), i adjust with the scultp tools, i subdivide, and then.. i refine the mesh adding loops, more bevels and some cuts. And i don't need more tools, all is done with some shortcuts.
    modo_workflow2.png

    Something like this, that can be done really fast, then you subdivide and you can use the pinch tool, smooth brush, etc.
    workflow_003.jpg

    On the left the level 0 with the subdivision turned off, and at the right the model subdivided x1 and edited a bit with the scultp tools.
  • pior
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    pior grand marshal polycounter
    Yeah, thats exactly the kind of quality I am looking for. I guess the question would be, how easy is it to redirect topology once a shape is established with the sculpt tool (I'd love to be able to start from a sphere, push and pull stuff around, and then "retopo" the base level accordingly). I'll just have to try it :) If anything, your workflow seems very good too.

    Can't wait to try it all again, I'll try 301 while waiting for the 601 demo eventually. I am really looking forward to finding a nice unified way to spit out sculpted blockouts really fast. If Max had simple sculpting tool it would be all I need but I don't think Autodesk programs will ever go in this direction now that they are pushing forward with the Mudbox bridge connection instead (great for asset production but not so unified)

    Exciting!

    On a side note, what about the tool shown at 3:20 here ?
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=zZal9aMnrO4#

    This seems great to add quick, low fidelity details to a blockout. Any of you guys used it ?
  • OBlastradiusO
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    OBlastradiusO polycounter lvl 11
    OMG. The new features on this looks awesummeee! :) Modo completely sold me with there superior modeling tools. Glad to see they have beefed it up!
  • Snefer
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    Snefer polycounter lvl 16
    pior: that tool at 3.20 is just the same sculpting tools. You can have alphas, pinching, carving, different kind of brushes etc just like in zbrush, but not at quite the same performancelevel. And I think in modo 301 they didnt have all the sculpting in yet?
  • cptSwing
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    cptSwing polycounter lvl 11
    Snefer wrote: »
    cptSwing and pior: Yes, they are fully integrated, great for just busting up and putting dents in hardsurface models. Stuff like just bringing up sculpting and then slightly smooth out a hard edge to get some varying hardness is great. The performance is not the best though, its not like zbrush, but yeah, for me it has removed zbrush from my workflow in many, many cases. Its also pretty nice because you can still use the regular modellingtools even if you are sculpting on something, for example if you realize you want more resolution in one particular spot you can just cut a few extra lines there and its done. I use the sculpting alot at work.


    That sounds pretty like i'd be happy with modo, then. definitely not a heavy user of sculpting apps, so cutting the 'middle man' out would be great ;)

    the viewport painting, any good?
  • Blaizer
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    Blaizer interpolator
    cptSwing, the painting is very generic, but it can be handy sometimes.
  • lefix
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    lefix polycounter lvl 11
    i personally would love to hear the opinion from experts in other fields than modeling/texturing.
    how is the modo renderer? am i able to produce the same quality images as max or maya etc? are any other renderers supporting modo, like vray?
    are the animation tools good enough yet to compete or will i still need additional software to get good results?
    hows the particle system, cloth simulation etc. for vfx?
  • Snefer
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    Snefer polycounter lvl 16
    This is all modo for example:

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OhFSXaw5DUo"]RUIN: Teaser Trailer - YouTube[/ame]

    I dont think there are other renderers that support modo, no, but the renderer is very capable. its very easy to use, but it lacks some of the custom things you would like to have, though. As for animation, I have no clue yet : D And cloth sim and volumetric particles were just added, so no idea there either : D
  • lefix
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    lefix polycounter lvl 11
    Hmm, that looks awesome, but, I just looked that up and found:

    "While that shot was done in Modo, I found it just wasn’t able to handle a scene this complex. So it was off to my old friend Lightwave."

    http://www.oddballanimation.com/archives/914
  • Skillmister
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    Skillmister polycounter lvl 11
    pior wrote: »

    [edit] Wait a minute ... they have a "try Modo" page but no trial download available ?? Way to shoot oneself in the foot ...

    The trial page disappeared when 601 released. I downloaded the previous trial just minutes before :o
  • James Edwards
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    James Edwards polycounter lvl 18
    Trial downloads were temporarily disabled upon upgrade releases in the past to allow the customer base to grab their paid for upgrades first. Lux couldn't handle the server demand on new releases, which is also why they would release torrents as well. Not sure if this is still the case, but I would expect the trial for 601 to be available very soon. I upgraded mostly for the long awaited animation tools. Using bones in modo feels like a neat little mix of blender and messiah.
  • Rabbid_Cheeze
    Been putting 501 through its paces last few days while waiting on the 601 demo to be released. It's better then I thought it would be in some ways, and worse in others. A few points of interest for those looking at it as a replacement for Max or Maya

    The default UV tools are not nearly as efficient as those found in Max 2012, but better then the defaults in earlier versions of Max.
    Component sliding is really bad if you have more then one vertex/edge selected at a time, unless they are selected as a closed loop.
    Splines are closer to those found in Maya (or Lightwave I guess) then Max.
    There is no FFD for modeling or cage support for baking.
    Convert Selection between component types requires an entire component to be encompassed before it will be selected (so if you wanted to select a face all of the verts it was made up of would need to be selected, not just one).
    Has the same problem as in Maya where you'll sometimes get double-edges.
    paint has stencils and stamps, but no proper layers (you can use separate maps stacked on each other however to emulate layers with no blending modes) or projection painting via an app link.

    From what I've read none of that has been changed in 601.

    One neat feature is the file browser used for kit bashing (Layout tab). You can just drag/drop meshes from it directly on to the surface of others in the scene.
  • dogzer
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    dogzer polycounter lvl 8
    Modo is quite good for subdivision modelling (just that), but as many of you already know, it hasn't got all the features we can find in max, such as the great amount of modifiers and tools (example: path deform).

    I've never used max's path deform for a real job, ever. So I'm good I guess!

    Still, the only reason I might not like modo 601, is if it turns out buggy as shyt! We'll see...
  • Fomori
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    Fomori polycounter lvl 12
    Good info Rabbid_Cheeze. Thanks.
  • lefix
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    lefix polycounter lvl 11
    i also read on the luxology forums that rendering is like up to 20% slower in this release.
    not that it would affect me much as a game artist, but for everyone this is a big issue.
    might just be something that'll get fixed soon, tho
  • Snefer
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    Snefer polycounter lvl 16
    For me the rendering is not slower at all. :) And i dont know, its pretty fast to begin with, I almost never render anything that takes longer than five minutes though : D Sometimes 10-20 if i go with 128 AA or so when rendering DOF.
  • Rabbid_Cheeze
    Import/Export have some bad scale issues with obj, and there don't seem to be any settings related to that. FBX works fine, but apps like ZBrush wont accept other formats. How are the regular Modo users here getting around that? I can't even find a way to export selected :(
  • Snefer
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    Snefer polycounter lvl 16
    Bad scale issues? Hmm, no havnt noticed that really. Sometimes when you go between apps and formats it changes the scale *100, but Ive had the exact same issue between other apps aswell. And no, there is no export selected, or not that I have seen/used atleast. Except for custom export scripts etc that I have. Not taht I miss that specific button :D You can just setup a macro for it in like 10 sec if you want it : )
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