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stopmotion... a real pain

yodude87
polycounter lvl 5
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yodude87 polycounter lvl 5
long story short, eventhough im a 3d modeller, currently im in a graphic design course, and one of my teachers asked us students for a stopmotion short video for an exam. have about 1-2 months to come up with something.

problem is, been trying some stuff, and the only thing ive come up with is the conclusion that this is a real pain in the ass :S tried toys, drawing, papercut, even udk xD but nothing :S

just wondering, how would you guys go about this? what do you think would be the best approach for this technique? not asking anyone here to do my job, just curious how other people would do such... ehrm... thing... ^^

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  • Shadownami92
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    Shadownami92 polycounter lvl 7
    Depends on how much time you want to spend on it honestly.

    In the long run, a silicon molded figure with an armature or a thick wire skeleton would work the best.

    In the short run, using clay characters of decently stiff clay would work best.

    What Aardman tends to do with to have a silicon mold for the body, and a clay face for more control over exaggerated facial movements.

    Another option would be to use action figures, get some clay that matches the color of the figure at their joints and put it around the joints, it removes the obvious seams and it makes the joints stiffer making it easier to have control.

    Hobby Lobby has mold/casting kits you could use. So you could sculpt a character in clay, make a mold, then you can make a wire skeleton and then use a liquid silicone that cures to fill in the mold around the skeleton. Not sure where the get the silicone for it honestly though. Might be able to experiment with using the cheap stuff that they have at hardware stores though. Then just paint over the thing.

    Youtube has lots of tutorials and info about stop motion as well. Another option would be to use wood figures, then you could just use wires connected to the hands or something for movement in front of a green screen, then remove the wires in aftereffects or something.

    An example of the use of wooden figures can be seen in the stop motion music video for Rifles Spiral.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yc7UaYnmqpY

    For how Aardman does Shaun the Sheep you can look at this one.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MZSLseSnWUE

    If you need any more help I could try to go more in depth and stuff.
  • spitty
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    spitty polycounter lvl 17
    you can also try animating people, might be easier than drawing or claymation. check this out and other stuff by pes on youtube.

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_5IqwECL6bo&feature=relmfu"]Human Skateboard by PES - YouTube[/ame]
  • Andreas
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    Andreas polycounter lvl 11
    What part of the process is bothering you? Also technically that video above, when you use real people, is called pixelation. Be careful you don't fail the assignment by doing the wrong thing.
  • yodude87
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    yodude87 polycounter lvl 5
    thanks for the tips, real good ideas there. will make sure i check them, and as soon as i get something together will post it here so that you guys can check it ^^ thanks for the availability :)
  • yodude87
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    yodude87 polycounter lvl 5
    Andreas wrote: »
    What part of the process is bothering you? Also technically that video above, when you use real people, is called pixelation. Be careful you don't fail the assignment by doing the wrong thing.

    its not as much as HOW its done (the process actually is simple i guess, pics of frames placed in sequence to make an animation)... but HOW to take these pictures, and what would be the best way to make the subjects (papercut, clay, etc). i mean, is it just a matter of patience and takingh loads of picturea, or pictures of keyframes, stuff like that :) total noob here as regards this kinda thing... now with those videos i got my ideas a bit clearer, will see if i can come up with something tomorrow...
  • Lamont
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    Lamont polycounter lvl 15
    It is hard, but it is really fun. You can use anything, and if you don't wanna blow tons of cash, design a character than can hold well with normal clay. I don't use timing sheets, I just break out a bit of paper and draw the motion, break it, then animate.

    I have a canon DSLR, a mount for my tripod for panning and trucking and a modded switch to fire the shutter(to keep hand vibrations down). I need to get a new tripod though the one I have now sucks. But it works.

    Here is one my 8 year old did for his winter assignment(I compiled the footage in premire):

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_JCWZkwDQUQ"]Winter Homework - YouTube[/ame]
  • pior
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    pior grand marshal polycounter
    I think that an efficient way to go a this would be to use objects that are already "stop motion friendly" instead of building complex characters from scratch. Think of the Pixar logo and Toy Story in general - the reason why it all works so well is because these works breath life into usually static objects.

    I tried it years ago with an articulated desk lamp and it worked wonders :) Abstract action figures could work very well too (legos, mechas, and so on...)
  • Shadownami92
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    Shadownami92 polycounter lvl 7
    Also based on how long your stop motion has to be you will probably want to have an area with set up lighting. I basically mean so that your lighting won't change as time goes by do to the time of day with sunlight shining through your window and stuff.

    Using a pre-existing object like a lamp sounds like a pretty good idea for this sort of thing like pior said, would probably save you a lot of trouble, time and money doing that sort of thing.
  • Naugat
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    Naugat polycounter lvl 12
    If the process is bothering you, try going back to basics; make a ballbounce using a coin, flat against a sheet of paper.

    Then add a piece of string to the coin and animate it a tail. After that, put a head and legs on it and make it walk (work your way up to this, it's not easy).

    This semi-2D style stop motion is as simple as animation can get, but even though it's a simple, look what Aardman did with it :)

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ieN2vhslTTU"]here[/ame]
  • Lamont
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    Lamont polycounter lvl 15
    The only problem with finding objects, is that if it is old, then the mechanism for keeping the joints from moving when you don't want them to is worn out. Try clay and make a simple object.

    Legos work well. Bionicles work great too (the joints). In the Bionicle joints I put something called Gorilla Snot to make the joints stick better (http://www.zzounds.com/item--GRSGOSNOT).
  • yodude87
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    yodude87 polycounter lvl 5
    thought a bit yesterday, and got to an idea that i hope works... making a skeleton with some wire, building some body for it with clay, and covering it with some white cloth.

    there we have it, altair ^^

    would be relatively easy to make him have a short run animation, then climb a not so tall wall, getting to a surface above the ground, and then jump. build a cart of sorts, and have him land there.

    thing is, as a plan it might look nice, lets see if it will work practically :) will keep the post updated, going out to buy the clay tomorrow morning, as all the specialized markets seem to be closed sunday :poly122:
  • Lamont
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    Lamont polycounter lvl 15
    Make sure your clay isn't too soft and the wire too stiff. When you try to bend the model the wire will stay while you slice your clay to bits.
  • Psyk0
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    Psyk0 polycounter lvl 18
    Or take a shorcut and use modified action figures...

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n3jfbAcsfX8"]Robot Chicken - Arkhum Asylum Shawshank Redemption [adult swim] - YouTube[/ame]
  • yodude87
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    yodude87 polycounter lvl 5
    Lamont wrote: »
    Make sure your clay isn't too soft and the wire too stiff. When you try to bend the model the wire will stay while you slice your clay to bits.

    yea, good point. if i wrap the body with some tape, like scotch tape? just to avoid the clay being sliced? as the cloth will cover the body, guess it wont be much of an issue after all
  • Jeff Parrott
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    Jeff Parrott polycounter lvl 19
    I don't know much about the subject. But if you need art-inspiration-fuel give Justin's blog a read though.

    http://justinrasch.blogspot.com/

    He's an amazingly talented Animator, lunch eater, and acrobatic guy. Sleeps about 2 hours a night and eats a whole cow daily (I think). Some of his youtubes might give you some ideas where to start.
  • Lamont
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    Lamont polycounter lvl 15
    yodude87 wrote: »
    yea, good point. if i wrap the body with some tape, like scotch tape? just to avoid the clay being sliced? as the cloth will cover the body, guess it wont be much of an issue after all
    Use that hard as a brick kids clay, build up your frame a bit with tin foil. That should work. You need something for the clay to grab on to.
  • JacqueChoi
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    JacqueChoi polycounter
    I did a clay animation once.

    DO NOT use clay.

    >_<



    Do what spitty suggests. Animate people.


    There's a legendary Canadian animator who won numerous academy awards named Norm McLaren. You should check out some of the stuff he did with the medium back in the 50's.


    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rgVk6SzirKs&amp;feature=related&quot;]Norman McLaren Neighbours 1952 - YouTube[/ame]
  • yodude87
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    yodude87 polycounter lvl 5
    JacqueChoi wrote: »
    I did a clay animation once.

    DO NOT use clay.

    >_<



    Do what spitty suggests. Animate people.


    too late, already bought the clay :S will start trying tonight, and see if it works... if it doesnt, will try the people animation (the video was awesome btw hahaah)

    im trusting the cloth covering the clay character will hide most of the eventual flaws... time will tell ^^
  • Drav
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    Drav polycounter lvl 9
    Any mention of stop motion should include this:


    http://youtu.be/IPoIwopVZPg
  • JacqueChoi
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    JacqueChoi polycounter
    yodude87 wrote: »
    too late, already bought the clay :S will start trying tonight, and see if it works... if it doesnt, will try the people animation (the video was awesome btw hahaah)

    im trusting the cloth covering the clay character will hide most of the eventual flaws... time will tell ^^

    Let me tell you about some of the issues I had (maybe you can help from them).

    Keep your hands and workspace 100% sterile, and clean. Each time you handle the clay, it will dirty up a little bit. Try to get good at using tools (although if you're already not a master at those tools, you'll probably get sick of them, and just use your hands anyways).

    The lights will melt your clay, so don't even turn them on, until you're ready to actually take your shot.

    The more you handle the clay, the more warped/melty it will become, so handle it as least as you possibly can. Possibly even keep a replica model just to refer yourself to what it's supposed to look like, so when it does inevitably start warping, and melting, you'll know what it's 'supposed' to look like, and you can hopefully start 'warping' it back throughout your sequence.


    Keep your hands COLD, and keep washing them.


    Don't touch different colours of clay without washing your hands/equipment. Skin, Yellows, and Whites, are notoriously the WORST for absorbing newer colours,.


    Every time you touch black, red, or blue, WASH everything thoroughly, or you will noticably get a dirtier and dirtier model as your shot progresses.



    BTW, not sure about any of you guys, but I found wire to be atrociously bad. I would highly recommend not even using it.
  • yodude87
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    yodude87 polycounter lvl 5
    JacqueChoi wrote: »
    Let me tell you about some of the issues I had (maybe you can help from them).

    Keep your hands and workspace 100% sterile, and clean. Each time you handle the clay, it will dirty up a little bit. Try to get good at using tools (although if you're already not a master at those tools, you'll probably get sick of them, and just use your hands anyways).

    The lights will melt your clay, so don't even turn them on, until you're ready to actually take your shot.

    The more you handle the clay, the more warped/melty it will become, so handle it as least as you possibly can. Possibly even keep a replica model just to refer yourself to what it's supposed to look like, so when it does inevitably start warping, and melting, you'll know what it's 'supposed' to look like, and you can hopefully start 'warping' it back throughout your sequence.


    Keep your hands COLD, and keep washing them.


    Don't touch different colours of clay without washing your hands/equipment. Skin, Yellows, and Whites, are notoriously the WORST for absorbing newer colours,.


    Every time you touch black, red, or blue, WASH everything thoroughly, or you will noticably get a dirtier and dirtier model as your shot progresses.



    BTW, not sure about any of you guys, but I found wire to be atrociously bad. I would highly recommend not even using it.

    whoa thanks, you probably saved me loads of hit and miss times :)

    will probably model 2 or 3 of the same character, the most identical i can, so that when one starts getting "weird", lets say, i just grab the other one and replace.

    and about the wire, will try and figure the best solution for a skeleton... even if its gonna be kinda tough for what i can see hehe
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