1. much better documentation
2. Better vertex paint system - like udk
3. Better and easier import/export - (models and textures)
Couldn't agree more on this. I loved using CE. But, the only reason I used it over UE was it's beautiful visuals. UE4 has reached a point offering just as beautiful visuals almost just as easily. I really don't see choosing CE over UE4 at this point unless they fix those 3 things listed.
We had quite the arguement about that at Crydev. I can only hope that what waits us at May is a miracle that show Cryetk's dedication to their "devvers", and not a apocalypse that would further hurt the already wounded community.
Well I wonder more about if we can make anything "beside" games. Just like people using unity to make educational applications for tablets can I make the same with Cryengine ?
The issue with Crytek is... They think they have so awesome tech, they are so awesome, that people should beg to be able to use their tech and beg to get some info about it... At least that is my feeling, when I look at what is going on.
All these secrecy, like they are scared someone might steal their ideas or something..
Oh their release times improved over past months, documentations is better, if we won't count programming documentation, which is non existent. Good look creating game in C++ without someone telling you what to do.
Mean time Unreal Engine 4:
1. Monthly updates (not yet, but I'm 100%, there are going to be monthly updaes as there were for UE3).
2. Developer interaction with community. Blog posts, answers on AnswerHub, on forums, explantions why some features do not make into engine etc. Dunno how long it will lasts, but it is good it is here, and it something that nearly non-existent in CryDev anyway...
Bare that CryDev is filled with whiners as well, but at least some of these whiners were created by lack of information/communication. When there is no explanation why there is no some feature added or simple "go away, we don't know and we don't care", then you can really start to wonder if anyone even read it...
3. Access to source code. It is important. I was able to find some answers, just by looking trough source.
4. Support for third party integrations.
5. Lots of sample high quality content, that you can use to do whatever.
CryEngine3, still have IMO better lighting (especially dynamic), and somewhat better default shader setup, but wonder how long it will last, when people will seriously start tinkering around UE4 and push shader/renderer changes back to upstream.
And I bet there will be people who will do it for sake of doing it.
Anyway I'm curious what will they show in May, though honestly I don't expect much. Nor do I think I will ever use CE3 again.
Unreal Engine 4 actually has a rough light propagation volumes feature that you can enable, that's the same type of dynamic lighting as CryEngine 3 (unless it has changed).
For me at least with static models and textures cryengine is the easiest engine out of UE3 and CE4 that I have used it is 10 sec job to perfectly import a model into cryengine but it took me a LONG time to find the blender to UE3 and even then my models often had a high failure rate. Maybe I did the wrong method of blender to UE3 in fact I probs did.
Look the point is I found it MANY MANY MANY times easier to import models from Blender to cryengine than I even did for unreal this may not be true for everyone but it is true for me.
For me at least with static models and textures cryengine is the easiest engine out of UE3 and CE4 that I have used it is 10 sec job to perfectly import a model into cryengine but it took me a LONG time to find the blender to UE3 and even then my models often had a high failure rate. Maybe I did the wrong method of blender to UE3 in fact I probs did.
Look the point is I found it MANY MANY MANY times easier to import models from Blender to cryengine than I even did for unreal this may not be true for everyone but it is true for me.
If you can export FBX, you can import to UE3 and UE4. Incredibly simpler than using the CryDev plugins (at least the Maya one is much more of a process)
If you can export FBX, you can import to UE3 and UE4. Incredibly simpler than using the CryDev plugins (at least the Maya one is much more of a process)
It's really not that hard to export... just hit add (mesh selected) and export and it's all set up for you. Instead of hitting the export through the Max options you do it through the roll out bar. It also saves you the step of importing it a second time in UE3,4.
It's really not that hard to export... just hit add (mesh selected) and export and it's all set up for you. Instead of hitting the export through the Max options you do it through the roll out bar. It also saves you the step of importing it a second time in UE3,4.
In Maya, I find myself having to change the working units to NTSC (which changes back for each new scene, despite trying to save it as default), I need to add a material and material group, in addition to clicking "Create CryExportNode" and exporting. Not to mention exporting the textures as CryTiff, which is only a very slight inconvenience, but still.
So, it tends to be a couple of extra steps, unless I'm doing something the long-way, which is a distinct possibility. It's not bad once you get used to it, though, but exporting to a native format is unarguably simpler.
You can also sell entire games with source, PBR shaders, voxel cone tracing lighting model, or modular pieces for an entire environment, basically anything you'd want or could add to a game or game engine.
Oh their release times improved over past months, documentations is better, if we won't count programming documentation, which is non existent. Good look creating game in C++ without someone telling you what to do.
Asset creation tutorial is also terrible. I spent "3 months" to understand how character rope/cloth/hair physics actually works. Because the info on the documentation was plain "wrong".
It's really not that hard to export... just hit add (mesh selected) and export and it's all set up for you. Instead of hitting the export through the Max options you do it through the roll out bar. It also saves you the step of importing it a second time in UE3,4.
Mate, I have exported working characters/objects/guns to Cryengine over the years. Even worked with the Cryengine 2.
Neither today nor back these years a single time comes to my mind that I was able to export things this easily.
I still export model and textures differently and "THEN" have to create my material inside Cryengine and add my maps MANUALLY ! Because the exporter insists on not creating any material even without giving an error message. It just doesn't do anything.
And frankly after a year I just gave up and started crating materials and assigning maps " after" I do the exporting. Faster than trying to understand what went wrong.
I'm using SoftCry exporter and so far exporting static meshes is as simple as fbx.
What I like about CE3 is speed, UE4 feels kinda slow in comparison.
The reason for that is in its flexibility. UE4 is by far and away more flexible than CryEngine is. And unless Crytek decide to release their source code with the subscription (very unlikely), that will never change.
example:
Take CryEngine's material system. you have a whole bunch of preset shaders to use, and sure they're quite powerful and flexible within that particular preset, but you can't compile your own new shaders at all and you can't edit the ones they provide outside of parameters they have decided to expose. what if you want a toon shader? what if you want a worldspace direction based shader (for example, something that shows something only on west facing sides)? you can't do any of that.
It's incredibly easy and fast to make something "just work" in CryEngine, but only if you want it to work within CryEngines preset parameters, which of course makes CryEngine easier to optimize.
And i have to say UE 4 is the way better deal, so WTF is that about this audio engine you have to license as well ? Seriously ? Also you end your subscription no more engine for you.
Not directed to Crytek Artists/programmers/etc. But your marketing and management sucks balls.
Quote from the FAQ of the Subscription based model.
"What will happen to my project if I cancel my subscription?
Stopping the subscription means that CRYENGINE and its Tools are no longer available in your account."
Also,
"What happens to the existing CRYENGINE Free SDK?
The CRYENGINE Free SDK will continue to exist; however, it will no longer receive further updates."
Cryengine can just go away. I welcome Epic and their Unreal 4 tech and future tech for the eternity. Lets make something fun!
Honestly. This release is so vague, that I can only wonder that it was like "Holy shit! Guys! It's end of the month and we are supposed to launch EaaS, this month! Do something!. Now!"
On other sides it lacks access to full source code. And that is actually very big deal. You can solve quite a few problems if you can see how something was implemented.
There is no feature list, there is nothing beyond single press note.
Not excited. Oh I will buy one month probably, just to see if there is something new, but I doubt I will ever change from UE4.
What will happen to my project if I cancel my subscription?
Stopping the subscription means that CRYENGINE and its Tools are no longer available in your account.
Does this mean say a downloaded build will stop working? I guess it does:), after all it's Crytek.
If the new version has PBR, I'll download it straight away to try it out. I'll probably get it anyway, considering I really love the free SDK, and I figure this'll be an improved version of that.
Not sure what all the hate here is about. Sure, it isn't as open as UE4, or as good of a deal, but it's another engine to put under your belt, and it has its benefits, art-wise.
Edit: The trailer says "Physically based shading", so I'm in.
If the new version has PBR, I'll download it straight away to try it out. I'll probably get it anyway, considering I really love the free SDK, and I figure this'll be an improved version of that.
Not sure what all the hate here is about. Sure, it isn't as open as UE4, or as good of a deal, but it's another engine to put under your belt, and it has its benefits, art-wise.
Edit: The trailer says "Physically based shading", so I'm in.
Well I'm also coding. And coding in CryEngine is something that I would not inflict upon my worst enemy.
Well I'm also coding. And coding in CryEngine is something that I would not inflict upon my worst enemy.
That's for damn sure.
I also feel like Crytek really didn't think this whole thing through as completely as they ought to have. The trailer is one I saw months ago, so whether it actually reflects what's being bought is questionable. Also, no real changelog is anywhere to be found. No how-to video to showcase some of the changes, and to get people drooling.
It seems very half-baked. I'll have to wait until Friday to get it anyway, maybe a change-log will surface by then.
I also feel like Crytek really didn't think this whole thing through as completely as they ought to have. The trailer is one I saw months ago, so whether it actually reflects what's being bought is questionable. Also, no real changelog is anywhere to be found. No how-to video to showcase some of the changes, and to get people drooling.
It seems very half-baked. I'll have to wait until Friday to get it anyway, maybe a change-log will surface by then.
That is true as well. There is nowhere to be seen the impact of how Epic started. Tutorial videos, blog posts, developers on forums answering stupid questions.
I actually quite like the default shader setup of CryEngine, and how easy is to make something look good.
But the problem is that advantage is quickly dropping. While there is really no other advantages from game development point of view. Or at least none that I'm aware of, which is also problem, because there is very little self-discoverability and point out nice features by Crytek.
I've bought a one month sub and going to give it a whirl.
But the lack of documentation/tutorials/release notes is slightly worrying. As much as I love using CryEngine, I may crawl back to UE4 if the support isn't there.
Would of like to have seen a better work flow for exporting. Hope that now we have to pay for the latest that the exporter tools are kept up to date. Having to keep previous version of modeling software just to export sucks.
I read this write up on the UE4 forums, makes me not even want to try out the new CryEngine.
I don't exactly know if I wanted this to be my first post on the forums in general, but I will give a go to relaying my thoughts about the latest goings-on in the CryEngine world.
I am currently developing with UE4 as a two man shop, but I have experience with various engines including the CryEngine. I have been watching to see what would happen since their announcement (with bated breath) following Epic's own UE4 announcement. Before UE4 and the very generous licensing terms accompanying it came down the pike we were ready to pull the trigger on Unity, but we are very glad we did not.
As I have stated I have used CryEngine in the past and I will be very clear in my opinion that I have never seen a company more disconnected and overtly condescending toward what we consider the indie space.
Now that the EaaS is out and it is nothing more than the FreeSDK that can be commercialized - I cannot say I am shocked, but that I am appalled by is what they believe they are going to get away with in their EULA.
1. There is no separation regarding what you bring to the table as in your code/art assets and retaining IP ownership over them.
2. It is at the sole discretion of Crytek to deem content racist, overly sexual or the very open ended/subjective word, "objectionable." Really? I mean honestly this is an acceptable clause in an engine you are licensing for commercial use that content can be deemed to be objectionable without clearly defining what would be considered objectionable at the start?
3. Wwise... where do I even start with this one? You must license with Audiokinetic for every game you publish that includes sound related media. You are limited to 200 media assets with a free license, but if you go over that the costs start to add up extremely fast. I am sorry, but this is akin to if Autodesk decided to limit the amount of renders you are able to complete with the full version of Max or Maya - and if you go over them - better cough up the money for a separate license... oh and on top of that it's a separate company you will be doing business with!
No small team in their right mind and with legal guidance is going to use the new EaaS program for a commercial project.
Before this new service and I have said before it was a very arrogant and condescending culture on the CryDev boards. One in which the peasants had the right to ask for absolutely nothing without being either ignored, brutalized or banned. Nothing has changed in my opinion and this one big glorified PR stunt.
The whole culture of Crytek needs to change before they can be trusted with what a good many of the people here consider to be either our current or potential future livelihood. It's a crying shame too because they do have an excellent engine (minus the the horrendous art asset pipeline) that should be able to go toe to toe with UE4 and with reasonable terms.
I am very happy that Epic has given the chance for the smaller outfits like myself and my partner to even have a chance utilizing what is undoubtedly one of the best engines in the business. I am also very thankful they are giving us access to intellectual property (source code) that at one time a small team might have had to sell their souls for and that they trust the community to help them in making the engine the best it can be.
Epic along with UE4 will continue to succeed on their own merits as long as the culture they fostered at the beginning of the release of UE4 continues throughout its life cycle.
I have been with CryEngine over 6 years now. And after EaaS I plan to move on....
Why ? Simple mein freunde.
It was at least free before, now it is the same thing with a cost.
I liked the engine even it had all these terrible flaws, but on the other hand which one of us was perfect ? Also it had no other requirement from me except my time and effort.
Don't get me wrong. It is not paying 10 bucks per month.
It is people at Frankfurt trying their best to screw us devs.
I simply had enough.
Unless they bring a miracle within a month it is sayanora.
cryengine is good and their new subscription plan is not bad at all, its just Epic dropped this shell in a really good way it sets the new bar that a lot of us will never look aside of it.
Honestly, from the lack of effort Crytek has made for its community over the time since they put out the free CDK. It's been pretty non-existent. As it shows clear as daylight with the recent EaaS plan for the engine. No full clarified written documentation that fills in the holes. Nothing of sample content for beginner developers of the engine. Also nothing tutorial related. As to mention, lack of direction appointed by Crytek themselves except where to put your money towards them...
Crytek has been "that game company" who is particularly stingy about who, and what gets released when licensing and using their technology. As I'm fine with Crytek making visually breathtaking products. Even if they lack substance to their design that would keep me peeled for hours.
I just have a knot twisted feeling about this as others have stated. Epic coming out of nowhere at GDC with this awesome subscription deal plan + a new engine. Then seeing Crytek have this backfire reaction of their own supposed thought out plan. Which seems very rushed with lack of much thought. I think with their given track record for being community driven is pretty non-existent. They are definitely internally driven and certainly strive to achieve success amongst all internal developers. But anything external. I see Crytek remaining and always will remain private about their internal affairs and development techniques to the outside world. Just so they reserve their talent and next best thing to show off for their next new IP, or continuing IP for that matter.
Again nothing against the talented staff of Crytek personally. But overall, I think this is just a shoe that Crytek doesn't fit well when trying to wear around in public.
I'm very in 3.6 and won't be making the switch from the free SDK. They're asking way too much money for a gimped product. There are still too many bugs and restrictions for me to even consider paying on a monthly basis. I'm more likely to make the switch to UE 4 as that will only cost me 20 €. It seems the only new thing is the the PBS. Other than that it's the same bad documentation, cumbersome asset pipeline, out of touch company and limited access.
Before this new service and I have said before it was a very arrogant and condescending culture on the CryDev boards. One in which the peasants had the right to ask for absolutely nothing without being either ignored, brutalized or banned. Nothing has changed in my opinion and this one big glorified PR stunt.
Hm, I would have hoped he'd give an example of this. Without knowing what to specially change in our approach with users it's hard to actually improve.
Upcoming Source Code release of CryAction and CryInput
Many of you have asked us about gaining more access to our Source Code. We had intended to prepare this for launch, but a small last minute delay meant we will shortly distribute the source code for both CryAction and CryInput within a new update for subscribers next week. These will give you access to many more systems within CRYENGINE, and allow for further flexibility in achieving your vision for your games. We’ll add more source code access in future updates as we continue to give access to more source code of CRYENGINE than ever before!
The CryAction Module includes game systems such as Flowgraph for Scripting, the MannequinCharacter and Animation tools as well as our Vehicles Editor.
The CryInput module includes the controller device implementation for gamepads, mouse and keyboard. Having access to this module makes it easier to add support for different input devices- such as a steering wheel or joystick.
This sounds like "Ooopppsss, community not happy, this was to rushed! We need to catch up Epic ASAP"
Non the less, I wish you guys best. More competition never hurt end users.
Guys. I can give one advice. Look at what is Epic doing, and just stop being so secretive, and disconnected from community.
Just play open cards. Lay out your plans, tell what are you intend to do, say that all plans are subject to change and everyone will be much more happy.
And please allow developers to actually post on forums, instead of two community managers . As much as I like them, it's not really what people now expect.
Few informations that would be useful, to know for start:
1. FBX/OBJ/DAE support for content ?
2. Monthly updates ?
3. Access to full source code, so users can make their own commits to main branch ?
4. Programming samples for "I know C++, but I have no idea what I'm doing in CE" ?
4a. This can go along with documentation of C++ API. Like what is the pattern of functionality. Epic have it very clearly stated out and documented. Pawn - Controller - GameMode - PlayerState - GameState.
4b. C++ sample games. And I mean sample. As few as code possible, well docummented, described of what is it doing.
To be perfectly honest what really throw me out of CE is programming. I was never able to get single game going from scartch. I always hit wall of "WTF is going on here".
In Unreal detting game from scratch took me 3 days.
Guys. I can give one advice. Look at what is Epic doing, and just stop being so secretive, and disconnected from community.
Just play open cards. Lay out your plans, tell what are you intend to do, say that all plans are subject to change and everyone will be much more happy.
And please allow developers to actually post on forums, instead of two community managers . As much as I like them, it's not really what people now expect.
Few informations that would be useful, to know for start:
1. FBX/OBJ/DAE support for content ?
2. Monthly updates ?
3. Access to full source code, so users can make their own commits to main branch ?
4. Programming samples for "I know C++, but I have no idea what I'm doing in CE" ?
4a. This can go along with documentation of C++ API. Like what is the pattern of functionality. Epic have it very clearly stated out and documented. Pawn - Controller - GameMode - PlayerState - GameState.
4b. C++ sample games. And I mean sample. As few as code possible, well docummented, described of what is it doing.
Great suggestions. Epic really turned the tables by being so completely open. If you get on their level regarding openness, I think a pricing structure closer to Epic's would work out. Now we pay $9.90 or whatever, per month (if we cancel, well, we lose it), for what's very similar to the SDK that was free. If you give us access to source code, and release more samples, and all that, and release more regular updates, I think you could charge the same as epic (but still let us use the engine if we cancel)...
Basically, copy everything Epic is doing, because they're doing it right.
And start supporting FBX, because that's what most people complain about.
I really love the engine, and I'd love to see more things built in it, but I really don't think that'll happen until it opens up.
I absolutely loved cryengine with all it's quirks & perks but I had to stop using it because I don't use 3ds, it's is a complete cvnt to work with if you are using modo. Once I started reading about indie devs not even getting a response for a licence request UDK was the best option. Crytek should stop being "closed" dicks and learn from Epic they might even be surprised to see what can be created with there engine :poly121:
Same attitude only with a price this time :poly108:
Grow a pair, go to the north pole, knock one out and wake up :thumbup:
Hm, I would have hoped he'd give an example of this. Without knowing what to specially change in our approach with users it's hard to actually improve.
I am the one who wrote my view on the EaaS over on the Unreal Engine forums.
The way you phrased your response to what I wrote is typical of what I mentioned about the, "culture" of your company.
I cannot believe that you could honestly sit there, and have to give more than a moment's thought about how the overall general approach of Crytek needs to change if they are going to offer a commercial service to the masses.
There are a lot of people around these parts who remember what was supposed to be the FreeSDK and what the plebs received throughout the years.
There are plenty of small little shops who remember the silence they were met with, the stonewalling or the frankly just being told to sit down and shut up whenever the question of licensing came up - before the EaaS.
There are plenty of developers whether by themselves or in teams who can point to many occasions where they were told to basically piss off when they ran into problems, and could make no use of outdated, and substandard documentation.
There have been countless times where fair criticism has been met with chastisement and the risk of being totally cutoff from the rest of the community.
I will reiterate what I said over on the UE4 forums:
Your EULA for the EaaS as it stands is completely bonkers. Anyone or any team, with any legal guidance or common sense, would never sign off on using the EaaS as the EULA currently stands.
1.) Where is the worded differentiation or Ownership Clause stating that what is Crytek's intellectual property is separate from the licensed developer's intellectual property? This is a gigantic and glaring omission - or is it purposeful?
2.) Your company is the deciding factor on what is and what is not, "objectionable" with no clear guidance on what would or would not be so other than to say too, "racist," or, "sexual."
When you couple those two things together spending any time or effort developing IP with the EaaS would be a dangerous path for a small studio.
You guys can release more source to other subsystems of the engine all day long, but until your EULA is fixed to make using the EaaS more equitable to the licensee - no one with common sense is going to use the engine for commercial purposes!
You also know what would help a great deal?
Dump every single moderator on CryDev and start over. You guys are making a big mistake using the same moderation staff - that a lot of people throughout the years (including myself) have watched with a great deal of disdain for how they treated what were at that time merely end users of a free SDK.
If you want to go from being a development studio and sometimes engine licensor to a commercial SAS vendor - then it's time to get with the program in other ways than simply offering a product.
The Ryse team had support. Try using Maya with the current FreeSDK and get back to me. I'm still trying to get it to export simple animation. Getting character animation into the engine with anything but Max seems like this arcane exercise. The first 2 releases in the 3.5 series had a completely broken Maya exporter.
Also, Maya is also a $4k license. I'm not sure what CryTek is really trying to do with their 'indie' engine. The poor Blender guys have gone back to using 3.4.5 because there is no documentation and no help from anyone at CryTek over basic stuff like 'what should we call materials?' I think that CryTek has 'indie' licenses just to tell their shareholders they're competing with UDK/UE4. They don't offer much in the way of docs or support. CryEngine really hasn't been a viable 'indie' engine.
lol, on steam you also have mayaLT for $99. But any way, import/export system in CE is crap.
Well when I saw this I couldn't believe my eyes. This is probably the first time Crytek listened to us. I was incredibly happy... tough I just wanted wait to be completely sure they will keep it up like that
So the next update will be 2 weeks later. I wonder waht will we see this time ???
@ Tan don't expect to much.... the cryengine was always my favorite engine but since the unreal engine 4 release, i just switched the engines...
I just couldn't belive how amazing the UE4 forum is.... developers are listening to the subsribers.... it was like jesus... whats going on here... is this real....
Cryengine gives a sh**** about what they developers and indies think and want, the most funny thing is the forum, where mebers and users wrote like good 10000 ideas / wishes for the "new" cryengine and what happen, nothing, same product, new price.....
maybe when all the developers stop using cryengine, they wake up and start to give a support and listen to the forum mebers and developers....
Take a look at the new UE4 "4.2" update, with the demo level "about cars / driving" it is just amaing how much they care.... and it is amazing how quick this updates are released....
this updates are hopefully the beginning of a new support.....
Replies
That's right, however I only think the animation team used Maya. I definitely know the Environment team used MAX
Couldn't agree more on this. I loved using CE. But, the only reason I used it over UE was it's beautiful visuals. UE4 has reached a point offering just as beautiful visuals almost just as easily. I really don't see choosing CE over UE4 at this point unless they fix those 3 things listed.
Well I wonder more about if we can make anything "beside" games. Just like people using unity to make educational applications for tablets can I make the same with Cryengine ?
All these secrecy, like they are scared someone might steal their ideas or something..
Oh their release times improved over past months, documentations is better, if we won't count programming documentation, which is non existent. Good look creating game in C++ without someone telling you what to do.
Mean time Unreal Engine 4:
1. Monthly updates (not yet, but I'm 100%, there are going to be monthly updaes as there were for UE3).
2. Developer interaction with community. Blog posts, answers on AnswerHub, on forums, explantions why some features do not make into engine etc. Dunno how long it will lasts, but it is good it is here, and it something that nearly non-existent in CryDev anyway...
Bare that CryDev is filled with whiners as well, but at least some of these whiners were created by lack of information/communication. When there is no explanation why there is no some feature added or simple "go away, we don't know and we don't care", then you can really start to wonder if anyone even read it...
3. Access to source code. It is important. I was able to find some answers, just by looking trough source.
4. Support for third party integrations.
5. Lots of sample high quality content, that you can use to do whatever.
CryEngine3, still have IMO better lighting (especially dynamic), and somewhat better default shader setup, but wonder how long it will last, when people will seriously start tinkering around UE4 and push shader/renderer changes back to upstream.
And I bet there will be people who will do it for sake of doing it.
Anyway I'm curious what will they show in May, though honestly I don't expect much. Nor do I think I will ever use CE3 again.
Look the point is I found it MANY MANY MANY times easier to import models from Blender to cryengine than I even did for unreal this may not be true for everyone but it is true for me.
If you can export FBX, you can import to UE3 and UE4. Incredibly simpler than using the CryDev plugins (at least the Maya one is much more of a process)
In Maya, I find myself having to change the working units to NTSC (which changes back for each new scene, despite trying to save it as default), I need to add a material and material group, in addition to clicking "Create CryExportNode" and exporting. Not to mention exporting the textures as CryTiff, which is only a very slight inconvenience, but still.
So, it tends to be a couple of extra steps, unless I'm doing something the long-way, which is a distinct possibility. It's not bad once you get used to it, though, but exporting to a native format is unarguably simpler.
Asset creation tutorial is also terrible. I spent "3 months" to understand how character rope/cloth/hair physics actually works. Because the info on the documentation was plain "wrong".
Mate, I have exported working characters/objects/guns to Cryengine over the years. Even worked with the Cryengine 2.
Neither today nor back these years a single time comes to my mind that I was able to export things this easily.
I still export model and textures differently and "THEN" have to create my material inside Cryengine and add my maps MANUALLY ! Because the exporter insists on not creating any material even without giving an error message. It just doesn't do anything.
And frankly after a year I just gave up and started crating materials and assigning maps " after" I do the exporting. Faster than trying to understand what went wrong.
What I like about CE3 is speed, UE4 feels kinda slow in comparison.
The reason for that is in its flexibility. UE4 is by far and away more flexible than CryEngine is. And unless Crytek decide to release their source code with the subscription (very unlikely), that will never change.
example:
Take CryEngine's material system. you have a whole bunch of preset shaders to use, and sure they're quite powerful and flexible within that particular preset, but you can't compile your own new shaders at all and you can't edit the ones they provide outside of parameters they have decided to expose. what if you want a toon shader? what if you want a worldspace direction based shader (for example, something that shows something only on west facing sides)? you can't do any of that.
It's incredibly easy and fast to make something "just work" in CryEngine, but only if you want it to work within CryEngines preset parameters, which of course makes CryEngine easier to optimize.
http://www.crydev.net/newspage.php?news=123637
http://www.crydev.net/newspage.php?news=123634
And i have to say UE 4 is the way better deal, so WTF is that about this audio engine you have to license as well ? Seriously ? Also you end your subscription no more engine for you.
Quote from the FAQ of the Subscription based model.
"What will happen to my project if I cancel my subscription?
Stopping the subscription means that CRYENGINE and its Tools are no longer available in your account."
Also,
"What happens to the existing CRYENGINE Free SDK?
The CRYENGINE Free SDK will continue to exist; however, it will no longer receive further updates."
Cryengine can just go away. I welcome Epic and their Unreal 4 tech and future tech for the eternity. Lets make something fun!
Honestly. This release is so vague, that I can only wonder that it was like "Holy shit! Guys! It's end of the month and we are supposed to launch EaaS, this month! Do something!. Now!"
On other sides it lacks access to full source code. And that is actually very big deal. You can solve quite a few problems if you can see how something was implemented.
There is no feature list, there is nothing beyond single press note.
Not excited. Oh I will buy one month probably, just to see if there is something new, but I doubt I will ever change from UE4.
Does this mean say a downloaded build will stop working? I guess it does:), after all it's Crytek.
Not sure what all the hate here is about. Sure, it isn't as open as UE4, or as good of a deal, but it's another engine to put under your belt, and it has its benefits, art-wise.
Edit: The trailer says "Physically based shading", so I'm in.
Well I'm also coding. And coding in CryEngine is something that I would not inflict upon my worst enemy.
That's for damn sure.
I also feel like Crytek really didn't think this whole thing through as completely as they ought to have. The trailer is one I saw months ago, so whether it actually reflects what's being bought is questionable. Also, no real changelog is anywhere to be found. No how-to video to showcase some of the changes, and to get people drooling.
It seems very half-baked. I'll have to wait until Friday to get it anyway, maybe a change-log will surface by then.
That is true as well. There is nowhere to be seen the impact of how Epic started. Tutorial videos, blog posts, developers on forums answering stupid questions.
I actually quite like the default shader setup of CryEngine, and how easy is to make something look good.
But the problem is that advantage is quickly dropping. While there is really no other advantages from game development point of view. Or at least none that I'm aware of, which is also problem, because there is very little self-discoverability and point out nice features by Crytek.
But the lack of documentation/tutorials/release notes is slightly worrying. As much as I love using CryEngine, I may crawl back to UE4 if the support isn't there.
http://www.crydev.net/viewtopic.php?f=125&p=1215904#p1215904
Source: https://forums.unrealengine.com/showthread.php?7344-Crytek-s-CryEngine&p=61190&viewfull=1#post61190
I have been with CryEngine over 6 years now. And after EaaS I plan to move on....
Why ? Simple mein freunde.
It was at least free before, now it is the same thing with a cost.
I liked the engine even it had all these terrible flaws, but on the other hand which one of us was perfect ? Also it had no other requirement from me except my time and effort.
Don't get me wrong. It is not paying 10 bucks per month.
It is people at Frankfurt trying their best to screw us devs.
I simply had enough.
Unless they bring a miracle within a month it is sayanora.
Crytek has been "that game company" who is particularly stingy about who, and what gets released when licensing and using their technology. As I'm fine with Crytek making visually breathtaking products. Even if they lack substance to their design that would keep me peeled for hours.
I just have a knot twisted feeling about this as others have stated. Epic coming out of nowhere at GDC with this awesome subscription deal plan + a new engine. Then seeing Crytek have this backfire reaction of their own supposed thought out plan. Which seems very rushed with lack of much thought. I think with their given track record for being community driven is pretty non-existent. They are definitely internally driven and certainly strive to achieve success amongst all internal developers. But anything external. I see Crytek remaining and always will remain private about their internal affairs and development techniques to the outside world. Just so they reserve their talent and next best thing to show off for their next new IP, or continuing IP for that matter.
Again nothing against the talented staff of Crytek personally. But overall, I think this is just a shoe that Crytek doesn't fit well when trying to wear around in public.
This sounds like "Ooopppsss, community not happy, this was to rushed! We need to catch up Epic ASAP"
Non the less, I wish you guys best. More competition never hurt end users.
Guys. I can give one advice. Look at what is Epic doing, and just stop being so secretive, and disconnected from community.
Just play open cards. Lay out your plans, tell what are you intend to do, say that all plans are subject to change and everyone will be much more happy.
And please allow developers to actually post on forums, instead of two community managers
Few informations that would be useful, to know for start:
1. FBX/OBJ/DAE support for content ?
2. Monthly updates ?
3. Access to full source code, so users can make their own commits to main branch ?
4. Programming samples for "I know C++, but I have no idea what I'm doing in CE" ?
4a. This can go along with documentation of C++ API. Like what is the pattern of functionality. Epic have it very clearly stated out and documented. Pawn - Controller - GameMode - PlayerState - GameState.
4b. C++ sample games. And I mean sample. As few as code possible, well docummented, described of what is it doing.
To be perfectly honest what really throw me out of CE is programming. I was never able to get single game going from scartch. I always hit wall of "WTF is going on here".
In Unreal detting game from scratch took me 3 days.
Great suggestions. Epic really turned the tables by being so completely open. If you get on their level regarding openness, I think a pricing structure closer to Epic's would work out. Now we pay $9.90 or whatever, per month (if we cancel, well, we lose it), for what's very similar to the SDK that was free. If you give us access to source code, and release more samples, and all that, and release more regular updates, I think you could charge the same as epic (but still let us use the engine if we cancel)...
Basically, copy everything Epic is doing, because they're doing it right.
And start supporting FBX, because that's what most people complain about.
I really love the engine, and I'd love to see more things built in it, but I really don't think that'll happen until it opens up.
Same attitude only with a price this time :poly108:
Grow a pair, go to the north pole, knock one out and wake up :thumbup:
I am the one who wrote my view on the EaaS over on the Unreal Engine forums.
The way you phrased your response to what I wrote is typical of what I mentioned about the, "culture" of your company.
I cannot believe that you could honestly sit there, and have to give more than a moment's thought about how the overall general approach of Crytek needs to change if they are going to offer a commercial service to the masses.
There are a lot of people around these parts who remember what was supposed to be the FreeSDK and what the plebs received throughout the years.
There are plenty of small little shops who remember the silence they were met with, the stonewalling or the frankly just being told to sit down and shut up whenever the question of licensing came up - before the EaaS.
There are plenty of developers whether by themselves or in teams who can point to many occasions where they were told to basically piss off when they ran into problems, and could make no use of outdated, and substandard documentation.
There have been countless times where fair criticism has been met with chastisement and the risk of being totally cutoff from the rest of the community.
I will reiterate what I said over on the UE4 forums:
Your EULA for the EaaS as it stands is completely bonkers. Anyone or any team, with any legal guidance or common sense, would never sign off on using the EaaS as the EULA currently stands.
1.) Where is the worded differentiation or Ownership Clause stating that what is Crytek's intellectual property is separate from the licensed developer's intellectual property? This is a gigantic and glaring omission - or is it purposeful?
2.) Your company is the deciding factor on what is and what is not, "objectionable" with no clear guidance on what would or would not be so other than to say too, "racist," or, "sexual."
When you couple those two things together spending any time or effort developing IP with the EaaS would be a dangerous path for a small studio.
You guys can release more source to other subsystems of the engine all day long, but until your EULA is fixed to make using the EaaS more equitable to the licensee - no one with common sense is going to use the engine for commercial purposes!
You also know what would help a great deal?
Dump every single moderator on CryDev and start over. You guys are making a big mistake using the same moderation staff - that a lot of people throughout the years (including myself) have watched with a great deal of disdain for how they treated what were at that time merely end users of a free SDK.
If you want to go from being a development studio and sometimes engine licensor to a commercial SAS vendor - then it's time to get with the program in other ways than simply offering a product.
Well that statement went wrong in a short time
Well when I saw this I couldn't believe my eyes. This is probably the first time Crytek listened to us. I was incredibly happy... tough I just wanted wait to be completely sure they will keep it up like that
So the next update will be 2 weeks later. I wonder waht will we see this time ???
I just couldn't belive how amazing the UE4 forum is.... developers are listening to the subsribers.... it was like jesus... whats going on here... is this real....
Cryengine gives a sh**** about what they developers and indies think and want, the most funny thing is the forum, where mebers and users wrote like good 10000 ideas / wishes for the "new" cryengine and what happen, nothing, same product, new price.....
maybe when all the developers stop using cryengine, they wake up and start to give a support and listen to the forum mebers and developers....
Take a look at the new UE4 "4.2" update, with the demo level "about cars / driving" it is just amaing how much they care.... and it is amazing how quick this updates are released....
this updates are hopefully the beginning of a new support.....
The UE4 working pipeline ist just amazing....