There's just something about the color of the wood on the buildings and the patterns in the frames that makes it look like a combination of traditional japanese houses and tudor houses, and I think it's brilliant. Maybe not intentional, but I love it. Heck, to push that, I'd suggest making the roofs of the buildings out of grey ceramic tiles.
Did you mention how you're lighting the scene here? Is it realtime or baked?
Thanks for the kind words! I kind of browsed through a bunch of different style's while trying to get some sort of inspiration kickstart for shapes and such: a little bit of WoW of course, kingdoms of kingdoms of amalur, skyrim (mostly for shapes and their visual language, not really the textures for this), dishonored, and the fable series (probably those two being the closest in terms of textures and color. Dishonored..was so sexy in style, and fable just makes me feel plain happy)
Also 17th-18th century and random Victorian architecture for figuring out some shapes and just a tad of fake historical accuracy. I wanted to double check that they had some sort of printing press during this sort of technological era (hence I chose using a Blackletter type for any current/future print images) I'd love to make a Gutenburg press somewhere, but that's probably way too specific and random in keeping this a manageable environment. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Printing_press#Gutenberg.27s_press
I took Wednesday off from doing contract ad work, can't wait to get back into this project and hopefully apply to some studios while I'm at it. (I always get nervous with cover letters, worst fear ever)
I'd love to add some actual geometric damage to the white walls other than cracks, but have sort of been having trouble figuring out just what the heck those walls were made of during that sort of time period. Was it a stone brick wall with some kind of plaster layered over? Some sort of concrete like mixture? Wooden frame on the inside to support the mold sort of like modern drywall? Oh boy research time.
Oh and to answer your question the main directional light source is actually set to stationary, so technically it's a little bit of both (with the global illumination bake and the real-time shadow when closer to the camera, and fade out to static bake after a certain distance). There's also a mixture of static and stationary lights placed here and there, and a couple of pure dynamic lights where I really wanted the shadows to crisp/pop out more.
I have to say I really enjoy being able to preview somewhat close to what it'll look like in Unreal before I bake, than say the hit-or-miss pray-that-I-chose-a-good-number Hammer editor XD (HL2 modding glory days)
Awesome stuff, I would say though, your cobbles on the floor are the thing that's losing it for me, if they were really cobbles then it would have to be on more even terrain, or add depth to the cobbles and have some sticking out of the ground.
Great stuff non the less, thought I would give my 2 cents.
I'd love to add some actual geometric damage to the white walls other than cracks, but have sort of been having trouble figuring out just what the heck those walls were made of during that sort of time period. Was it a stone brick wall with some kind of plaster layered over? Some sort of concrete like mixture? Wooden frame on the inside to support the mold sort of like modern drywall? Oh boy research time.
For white walls like you've got, it would most likely be real plaster made with horse hair over very basic wooden framing. I know for sure that was in use in the 19th century and it was pretty standard then, which means it undoubtedly originated before that. It cracks very easily and you can't put nails in it. It also gets really crumbly if it's damaged, so almost anything larger than a hairline crack would have soft edges and probably a lot of dust. There would be space between the inner and outer walls, which would at best have straw for insulation. If the buildings have been there for more than a few years animals will start breaking in to the walls (usually from somewhere near the roof) and running around in that space. Squirrels are the most likely culprit there, though anything small enough can get in. It's sort of the origin of the stereotypical cartoon mouse hole; if there aren't cats hanging around the mice will eat through the plaster to the inside so they can steal food scraps. (For extra bonus realism, feature some cats sitting around staring intently at walls. Squirrels running around in there drives them nuts. )
That damn cobble path will be the end of me haha. I'm not a big fan of the idea of placing a ton of cobble stone models by hand (tried that with the bricks and gave up XD) on the landscape, but maybe I can see what I can do with adding some normal maps to it and possibly cutting up the cobbles into smaller fragments/closer to large pebble size to get away with not having to do flatter terrain as a personal choice. Two-cents are always appreciated! Thanks
Thanks for the bit of history/feedback on the walls iconoplast! Inspired by your post, I spent some time today trying to do a bit more research to get some sort of basic understanding of the techniques used around that time period that might aesthetically fit.
(keep in mind that the following is a guy (me) with a BFA background browsing the internet, and has no real-world architecturally verified knowledge so my understanding may be incorrect, but hey I figured I'd share it for sake of interest to others)
I learned a bit about the wattle-and-daub technique of weaving branches or splats together which I thought was pretty cool. From the various sources I looked at I'm assuming between the large timber frames would be this wattle layer of woven branches or splats daubed with some sort of composite mixture for sealing. I'd guess a layer such as straw would be added next for insulation, and then a plaster-like mixture of lime, clay, animal hair for strengthening, etc would be for the exterior layer (the white wall part you'd normally see).
Here was a fun little article on the evolution of timber framing that I browsed through and thought contained some nice tid-bits of informationhttp://www.buildingscience.com/documents/insights/bsi-033-evolution and of various methods, such as vertical wooden siding or weather-boarding (A process that seems a bit more skyrim-esque to me)
And here's some images of reference I found online as I try to gain a better understanding of how it might look in my environment with built/crumbling/various layers/etc.
and I have no idea what this says but I was more interested in the space between the two grey walls which I'd assume would be the exterior wall. So if the wall was destroyed so all of the layers could be seen it would go white plaster, the wattle-and-daub weave type thing, straw insulation, and then another plaster layer.
Feel free to correct me if I'm waaay off, can't hurt to have a a better basic understanding of what materials are used and how they are constructed in real-life!
And as a bonus, found a sort-of related video on people constructing a hutt built out of clay, slip, and straw. I don't think it would really fit for this particular environment, but maybe for something more rural/worldly such as a small satellite farm/village or a cheaper construction of an open horse stable.
This is turning out insanely well . Love the research you are doing on the walls, imo that will add that extra believability to it.
I often ask my father to help me out with these stylized environments. He is an architect and he goes nuts when he sees some of the exaggerated stuff . I then explain that it's all about the looks, but I need to add some believability to it.
So I guess my advice at this moment is to do the research, but keep in mind that the aesthetics should come first. Don't compromise look for realism I think, but add as much as you can.
I mean no one cares that the roof tiles for example in Warcraft would allow rain to drip inside the houses, they look good, end of story .
Love to see the whole progress of this and love the stylized way you paint all the textures.
The overall scene has good consistancy and a nice vibe to it all.
Maybe add some more wear and tear on most of the things, and maybe add a little touch of human-ness to the overly straight pillars on the housing, giving them a slight bend in some way may improve the natural feel of the structures, but that depends on where you want to go ofcourse.
The straw in that diagram would be the part I was rambling about squirrels getting in to -- it settles over time and naturally has gaps (honestly, why no one thought of using bales until recently is beyond me). My information is mostly based on experience living in old houses.
For really realistic wear and tear, think about how humans tend to use rooms. If there's a staircase, the walls will be much dirtier between waist and chest height; even if there's a railing people run their hands along the walls and the oils and dirt build up fast. Flooring wears down much faster where people walk. There will be far more scratches, dirt, and general damage. If there's a chair that will be moved often (like at a table or desk), that will damage wood floors over time. One place I lived had the original wood floors (about 120 years old at the time I think) that weren't well maintained, and large chips started coming up from the wood around my desk. I'd presume a non-wheeled chair would do a bit more damage if someone's scooting around at all while still sitting in it. Also, the walls will be progressively more soot and smoke stained with age. When an open fire is your only heating it tends to be a fairly large one, and a lot of the smoke escapes into the room. First bonus fact: if it's winter, everyone sleeps where the fire is. The nobility will usually get fireplaces in their bedrooms with servants to tend the fires, but everyone else gets to dogpile.
In the tavern, in case you do go for it, the walls will wear fastest at the average shoulder height -- drunk people love leaning on things. There's likely also damage at around shin height from people kicking (bar fights, clumsiness...). For outdoor pillars and lamp posts, the most wear is around the shoulder height of kids. They'll grab the poles and swing around them in circles. If you want to be really sneaky, you can scratch some symbols in to them. We have historical record of hobos doing that to communicate, and it would amaze me if that's the only period in which it happened. It's just that wood tends to evade the historical record, especially when it's left outdoors or replaced.
Also, if you want more historical accuracy I would cut back on the bookshelves. Unless someone's a part of the nobility they're almost certainly illiterate. Even if they can read it's unlikely they'd have money for books. Your second bonus fact for today: if you want to show a kitchen-like place, it's really rare for a stove to actually be inside. You'd either have a fireplace/hearth where the cooking happens or a small outbuilding with a stove in it. In their early days, stoves were notorious for starting fires. Often. Very very often. Also, there were no enclosed stoves as we think of them until the 1730s and they weren't really widespread until the 1790s or so (probably because of that fire problem, plus the chimneys mostly sucked).
Replies
Did you mention how you're lighting the scene here? Is it realtime or baked?
Also 17th-18th century and random Victorian architecture for figuring out some shapes and just a tad of fake historical accuracy. I wanted to double check that they had some sort of printing press during this sort of technological era (hence I chose using a Blackletter type for any current/future print images) I'd love to make a Gutenburg press somewhere, but that's probably way too specific and random in keeping this a manageable environment. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Printing_press#Gutenberg.27s_press
I took Wednesday off from doing contract ad work, can't wait to get back into this project and hopefully apply to some studios while I'm at it. (I always get nervous with cover letters, worst fear ever)
I'd love to add some actual geometric damage to the white walls other than cracks, but have sort of been having trouble figuring out just what the heck those walls were made of during that sort of time period. Was it a stone brick wall with some kind of plaster layered over? Some sort of concrete like mixture? Wooden frame on the inside to support the mold sort of like modern drywall? Oh boy research time.
Oh and to answer your question the main directional light source is actually set to stationary, so technically it's a little bit of both (with the global illumination bake and the real-time shadow when closer to the camera, and fade out to static bake after a certain distance). There's also a mixture of static and stationary lights placed here and there, and a couple of pure dynamic lights where I really wanted the shadows to crisp/pop out more.
I have to say I really enjoy being able to preview somewhat close to what it'll look like in Unreal before I bake, than say the hit-or-miss pray-that-I-chose-a-good-number Hammer editor XD (HL2 modding glory days)
Great stuff non the less, thought I would give my 2 cents.
For white walls like you've got, it would most likely be real plaster made with horse hair over very basic wooden framing. I know for sure that was in use in the 19th century and it was pretty standard then, which means it undoubtedly originated before that. It cracks very easily and you can't put nails in it. It also gets really crumbly if it's damaged, so almost anything larger than a hairline crack would have soft edges and probably a lot of dust. There would be space between the inner and outer walls, which would at best have straw for insulation. If the buildings have been there for more than a few years animals will start breaking in to the walls (usually from somewhere near the roof) and running around in that space. Squirrels are the most likely culprit there, though anything small enough can get in. It's sort of the origin of the stereotypical cartoon mouse hole; if there aren't cats hanging around the mice will eat through the plaster to the inside so they can steal food scraps. (For extra bonus realism, feature some cats sitting around staring intently at walls. Squirrels running around in there drives them nuts.
Thanks for the bit of history/feedback on the walls iconoplast! Inspired by your post, I spent some time today trying to do a bit more research to get some sort of basic understanding of the techniques used around that time period that might aesthetically fit.
(keep in mind that the following is a guy (me) with a BFA background browsing the internet, and has no real-world architecturally verified knowledge so my understanding may be incorrect, but hey I figured I'd share it for sake of interest to others)
I learned a bit about the wattle-and-daub technique of weaving branches or splats together which I thought was pretty cool. From the various sources I looked at I'm assuming between the large timber frames would be this wattle layer of woven branches or splats daubed with some sort of composite mixture for sealing. I'd guess a layer such as straw would be added next for insulation, and then a plaster-like mixture of lime, clay, animal hair for strengthening, etc would be for the exterior layer (the white wall part you'd normally see).
Here was a fun little article on the evolution of timber framing that I browsed through and thought contained some nice tid-bits of information http://www.buildingscience.com/documents/insights/bsi-033-evolution and of various methods, such as vertical wooden siding or weather-boarding (A process that seems a bit more skyrim-esque to me)
And here's some images of reference I found online as I try to gain a better understanding of how it might look in my environment with built/crumbling/various layers/etc.
and I have no idea what this says but I was more interested in the space between the two grey walls which I'd assume would be the exterior wall. So if the wall was destroyed so all of the layers could be seen it would go white plaster, the wattle-and-daub weave type thing, straw insulation, and then another plaster layer.
Feel free to correct me if I'm waaay off, can't hurt to have a a better basic understanding of what materials are used and how they are constructed in real-life!
And as a bonus, found a sort-of related video on people constructing a hutt built out of clay, slip, and straw. I don't think it would really fit for this particular environment, but maybe for something more rural/worldly such as a small satellite farm/village or a cheaper construction of an open horse stable.
I found it interesting nevertheless: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qab_hIoh5BQ
I often ask my father to help me out with these stylized environments. He is an architect and he goes nuts when he sees some of the exaggerated stuff
So I guess my advice at this moment is to do the research, but keep in mind that the aesthetics should come first. Don't compromise look for realism I think, but add as much as you can.
I mean no one cares that the roof tiles for example in Warcraft would allow rain to drip inside the houses, they look good, end of story
The overall scene has good consistancy and a nice vibe to it all.
Maybe add some more wear and tear on most of the things, and maybe add a little touch of human-ness to the overly straight pillars on the housing, giving them a slight bend in some way may improve the natural feel of the structures, but that depends on where you want to go ofcourse.
Keep us updated and keep on working on it!
For really realistic wear and tear, think about how humans tend to use rooms. If there's a staircase, the walls will be much dirtier between waist and chest height; even if there's a railing people run their hands along the walls and the oils and dirt build up fast. Flooring wears down much faster where people walk. There will be far more scratches, dirt, and general damage. If there's a chair that will be moved often (like at a table or desk), that will damage wood floors over time. One place I lived had the original wood floors (about 120 years old at the time I think) that weren't well maintained, and large chips started coming up from the wood around my desk. I'd presume a non-wheeled chair would do a bit more damage if someone's scooting around at all while still sitting in it. Also, the walls will be progressively more soot and smoke stained with age. When an open fire is your only heating it tends to be a fairly large one, and a lot of the smoke escapes into the room. First bonus fact: if it's winter, everyone sleeps where the fire is. The nobility will usually get fireplaces in their bedrooms with servants to tend the fires, but everyone else gets to dogpile.
In the tavern, in case you do go for it, the walls will wear fastest at the average shoulder height -- drunk people love leaning on things. There's likely also damage at around shin height from people kicking (bar fights, clumsiness...). For outdoor pillars and lamp posts, the most wear is around the shoulder height of kids. They'll grab the poles and swing around them in circles. If you want to be really sneaky, you can scratch some symbols in to them. We have historical record of hobos doing that to communicate, and it would amaze me if that's the only period in which it happened. It's just that wood tends to evade the historical record, especially when it's left outdoors or replaced.
Also, if you want more historical accuracy I would cut back on the bookshelves. Unless someone's a part of the nobility they're almost certainly illiterate. Even if they can read it's unlikely they'd have money for books. Your second bonus fact for today: if you want to show a kitchen-like place, it's really rare for a stove to actually be inside. You'd either have a fireplace/hearth where the cooking happens or a small outbuilding with a stove in it. In their early days, stoves were notorious for starting fires. Often. Very very often. Also, there were no enclosed stoves as we think of them until the 1730s and they weren't really widespread until the 1790s or so (probably because of that fire problem, plus the chimneys mostly sucked).