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Normal map workflow

brianmac90
brianmac90
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brianmac90
Hello,

From searching online forums and Polycount its clear I am not alone in my very consistent and frustrating problems with normal maps. This post is not for for a specific problem with a model its more to find out what you pro's think is the most hassle free and fast workflow to produce a quality model with a normal map. Personally I have tried Mudbox, Zbrush, Xnormal and Baking in Max. I find I get the best results when baking within Max which not always suitable for organic art. Zbrush has caused nothing but frustration while Mudbox hasn't give me much better in terms of results.

Xnormal I am still learning so I do not still have a verdict on that but so far I am seeing more potential. I would like to ask is Max 2014 problematic with normal maps because I find the directX shader problematic at times. Please note I am using Zbrush 4R6 and Mudbox 2012. My GPU is an AMD 5870 with 16 Gb ram


Please let it be noted I have changed and turned off the gamma in max and still get consistent errors such as seams. I have also fliped the green channel initially in Zbrush and in max. I have tinkered with countless settings from suggestions on forums but may be missing something as I am just learning so I have decided to come and annoy everyone here :poly124:.

Do many people use topogun (Retopologize) in their pipeline?

Is there a bug I am missing in the tools I use?

Basically what is your thoughts on the tools and pipeline which should be used when creating normal maps?

If you take the time to read my big long post I commend you haha thanks for any feedback. :)
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  • Futzy
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    Futzy
    I've been learning this process while getting used to UE4, and have found xnormal object space bake (with cage) -> handplane UE3 preset for tangent space works well for that engine.
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  • brianmac90
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    brianmac90
    Futzy wrote: »
    I've been learning this process while getting used to UE4, and have found xnormal object space bake (with cage) -> handplane UE3 preset for tangent space works well for that engine.

    I havent tried Xnormal with cage I will try learn that. This may be me being misinformed but as far as I know you cannot animated an object space map can you?

    Thank for the feedback :)
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  • Futzy
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    Futzy
    All engine seem to interpret tangent space maps differently, Handplane can be used to take an object space map and translate it into the correct tangent space map for a few different renderers/engines.
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  • brianmac90
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    brianmac90
    Ok cool good to know I was unsure about object space being deformable. I must take a look at what different engines can do with normals. They are such a technical area so much can go wrong with them. The reason I was cautious of object space maps is because in the majority of portfolios I come across the standard type of normal map seems to be tangent.
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  • Fogbrain
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    Fogbrain polycounter lvl 5
    I suggest learning about xnormal and how the different between object space and tangent space is, which also leads me to another great tool and place the learn about that kind of stuff. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m-6Yu-nTbUU, so check out Handplane, which is now Freeware, I haven't used it much but it should be helpful. http://www.handplane3d.com/.

    In regards to workflow, I'm no pro at normals myself but so far my successes will come from High Poly mesh in xnormal with low poly mesh, correct the settings, create a cage in Max or whatever program you use and insert that to your cage option under low poly.

    Also mess around with ray distance calculator. It may provide better or worse results, it depends. Also read up on normals in the polycount wiki. It's awesome :D
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  • brianmac90
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    brianmac90
    Fogbrain wrote: »
    I suggest learning about xnormal and how the different between object space and tangent space is, which also leads me to another great tool and place the learn about that kind of stuff. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m-6Yu-nTbUU, so check out Handplane, which is now Freeware, I haven't used it much but it should be helpful. http://www.handplane3d.com/.

    In regards to workflow, I'm no pro at normals myself but so far my successes will come from High Poly mesh in xnormal with low poly mesh, correct the settings, create a cage in Max or whatever program you use and insert that to your cage option under low poly.

    Also mess around with ray distance calculator. It may provide better or worse results, it depends. Also read up on normals in the polycount wiki. It's awesome :D

    Thanks for that link its great. It seams more people tend to use Xnormal with a cage. Especially when producing game art. I never have success when export a direct Normal map from Zbrush or Mudbox. Since the two responses seem to be leaning towards Xnormal and now handplane I will try these method. That video gave me a better insight on how normal maps are processed. I thought normal maps would be much easier at the start of learning which was very naive of me. :P Thanks for the help. :)
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  • Fogbrain
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    Fogbrain polycounter lvl 5
    Trust me, once you wrap your head around normals and how they work, especially in UV'ing, you'll have this big "aha!" moment and everything will be a bajillion times easier.

    Best of luck man.
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  • Shrike
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    Shrike interpolator
    3DS viewport is a mess, always try in another engine how it looks. The brdf and the gamma make everything look crap. You can disable gamma correction in the options that makes it a bit better, but test out somewhere else to not get all those black terminator shadows 3ds does. Make sure you have the right Y direction for each engine. 3DS uses Y-

    Doing Xnormal with cage and works pretty good, well I guess its the most used option
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  • Joao Sapiro
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    Joao Sapiro sublime tool
    i guess the stickies in this forum are tehre to be ignored...

    http://www.polycount.com/forum/showthread.php?t=107196

    be more pro-active people please...
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