Im kind of stumped on what the Reflectance color should be. Im working on an rpg7 . For the green rocket paint my Albedo = 5c5126 Microsurface = 808080 Reflectance = 403b2f. For wood guard on the tube i am wanting brown paint (not stained). Albedo = 26221c Microsurface = 656565 Reflectance = 3c3a37.
Reed
-Most paints are Polyurethane, which has a similar reflectance of plastic, plexiglass, and some glass.
-This range in Hue/Saturate/Brightness is mostly between ~22% and ~24% or 25% brightness. In Hex, between 393939 and 3e3e3e. These are just gray colors, in gamma space.
-You can add some color for a "colored" plastic specular, but keep your brightness around the same range.
Is there a way to do lightbeams in marmoset 2? I can't seem to find a good method. the dithering looks very poor so i'm just curious if there is a better way.
"You can add transparency with the transparency module in the material, click the drop-down on the right to select a transparency type, add is good for glass, cutout is standard alpha testing and dithered is good for mostly opaque objects that need fuzzy edges like hair."
For transparency, I get that add is good for glass and dithering good for hair but is cutout basically just a 0 or 1 functionality? There isn't a good alpha option for a fading beam of light?
i would use dithering for that as well, Slosh (or even add would work with the right textures). if you use dither, set the scene resolution to 2:1 ratio, and then render out at a really big screen res. when you resize down afterward you shouldn't notice the dithering.
i would use dithering for that as well, Slosh (or even add would work with the right textures). if you use dither, set the scene resolution to 2:1 ratio, and then render out at a really big screen res. when you resize down afterward you shouldn't notice the dithering.
Yeah this is the best way to do it for now.
We do not currently support traditional soft alpha blending, because it has so many technical issues (with sorting, and differed rendering stuff that we do).
i would use dithering for that as well, Slosh (or even add would work with the right textures). if you use dither, set the scene resolution to 2:1 ratio, and then render out at a really big screen res. when you resize down afterward you shouldn't notice the dithering.
Additive would probably be best, yes. but it depends on the look you're going for, i suppose.
As a side note, here's a little video showing some of the shader changes i've made. It shows the default blinn-phong shape for Toolbag2, and then the GGX shape used by UE4/The Order 1866, and finally a Beckmann skin specular shape:
Hi guys. I've been using Marmoset 2 for a while now and one thing that i haven't been able to find is the ability to link lights specifically to geometry. Just like in UDK we have Lighting Channels etc.
I've looked online aswel but haven't been able to find anything. Is there any future plans to incorporate something like this? Or is it already here and i'm totally missing something?
As someone not super familiar with the math behind the scenes in most shaders, can someone give me a quick breakdown of what makes GGX a potentially better option than the Blinn-Phong model currently present in TB2?
i'm not necessarily sure that it's "better", but it does look different and it (in my opinion) seems to be a more realistic representation of light.
essentially though, what you'll see is an overall softer reflection, with a longer "tail" to any reflective hotspots. you can see in the images i posted above, there is a tail even at the highest glossiness, while blinn-phong is a very "tight" reflection shape.
i thought you could already mimic GGX with secondary specular out of the box. i think it gives more control to create that subtle micro surface specular falloff. although it would be even better to have option to use GGX on either primary and/or secondary specular.
Gir, any tips on how to make those tweaks ourselves? I'd love having the option to use GGX as opposed to Blinn-phong, without waiting for it to be implemented officially.
[edit:] I opened up the files, and tried to somehow hope to magically understand what I needed to do, and also looked up the equations for GGX specular distribution; scratched my head for a minute, and closed the file.
[edit:] Also tried to enable masking the Newton Rings. 0 for 2. Maybe I should try to learn how to edit these things before attempting to edit them, ha...
well i can put the file out there for people to use, that's not a problem. but it's under the understanding that it's completely unnofficial, unsupported, and neither i or the guys at marmoset are responsible if your computer sets on fire as a result.
i'm also trying to figure out if i can make them toggleable as shader types (i can, but it means locking out existing types at the moment).
right now i'm trying to make the IBL portion of the skin specular sync up with the point light part, at the moment its glossiness doesn't blur out at the right rate.
I didn't have net on my main pc in the last few days and was disappointed to find out I couldn't use tb2. Not even in a trial mode of sorts. I understand you want to protect your product but it sucks not being able to use something you own.
DISCLAIMER: this is in no way affiliated with Marmoset.co, and is entirely unsupported both by them and by myself. Loading this shader is done of your own choice and any adverse performance in toolbag should be recognised as a result of that choice.
INSTRUCTIONS: this is very important, you must browse to: Marmoset Toolbag 2\data\shader\mat\reflection and then rename "directPhong.frag" to "directPhong_backup.frag". This is because toolbag currently reads specific file names for its shaders, and you want to make sure you keep the old one so you can revert back but also make sure it isn't read by toolbag.
Then drop the "directPhong.frag" and "GGX_calcs.frag" from the zip into the same folder as above. when you load toolbag next you will have the GGX specular shape for lights.
it's important to note that this doesn't affect the way IBL works at all. i'm working on that but there are a couple of roadblocks i've got to overcome and i'm quite busy right now. however the default toolbag IBL is close enough that you probably wouldn't see the difference.
I'm trying to do some turntables to my character but I have an issue with Scene turntable mode. I just want to rotate the model and keep my lighting, but when I export my turntable, Skylight position changes. Any thought? Thanks
@ Ballo, this was a bug in initial release only. It has been fixed for a while now. Make sure you have the latest update installed.
also make sure to use "scene turntable" only and set camera and sky turntable to 0
if you have any custom lights make sure to parent all lights under the sky.
Hi. I couldn't find a solution. Put sky rotation to 0, it isn't a solution for me, because I prefer lighting from left. I parented all the dynamic lights to the sky, but still doesn't work, because that isn't the problem. I dunno it is a bug or not. Amw, thanks!
just to clarify, you can have any custom rotation to the sky but under the animation tab the sky needs to be set to 0 since all you need for the turntable is the scene rotation/turntable (sky wont move when you just use scene turntable)
If we're talking about turntable stills export, the settings in the animation tab do not relate to what is exported. The animation tab settings are only for preview in the viewport. Though the type of turntable you set here should match what is exported (when the settings match of course).
From the image export settings panel (ctrl+p) you can set the turntable type to scene, camera, or sky, and use the clockwise checkbox to set which direction it goes in.
There was an issue with the sky jumping on turntable export, but that should have been fixed. Ballo, if you could check to make sure that is happening, and tell me which turntable export settings you're using that would be great. If you can get me a scene that shows the issue I may be able to give you some sort of solution in the meantime.
What MM has suggested should work, in my experience at least.
There was an issue with the sky jumping on turntable export, but that should have been fixed
That is what is happening to me. For example, on MM file(thanks!) when I export still images sky rotation change from 140 to 239/240, more or less. Same that happened to me at my file.
Is it possible to invert the viewport zoom with the mouse wheel? It's the opposite of what I'm used to and when I change back and forth between Toolbag and my 3D applications I keep confusing myself.
I've been having this really annoying problem. I can't figure out why these artefacts are appearing in certain areas of my mesh, and was wondering if anyone could help?
I have highlighted the problem area in red. The mesh is using a simple default material, with no normal map, and looks fine inside Maya's view port.
Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.
That is what is happening to me. For example, on MM file(thanks!) when I export still images sky rotation change from 140 to 239/240, more or less. Same that happened to me at my file.
I'm just using default settings, with 2.03.
Thanks again.
you are right, i didnt bother to check the actual rendered files to see if the sky matched the settings and it seems it doesnt match viewport settings.
I'm getting some bad transparency artifacts when rendering out turntables
would really like some idea as to what's happening
I believe it has to do with the local reflections because rendering with local reflections off gives me no problems
I would like to see this fixed as those reflections are very pretty
starting to get pretty annoyed with some of the problems I'm running into
my render outputs lighting doesn't match that of my viewport
any idea as to why this is happening?
Ideally in your AO map. If you don't have a seperate one put it (as white) in your metalness map so your diffuse is black and it uses your albedo for the spec, then make it black in your albedo as well.
I would be nice import some cameras with fbx, I don't have enough control with Marmo ones. I'm trying to rotate or transform cameras with control numeric at transform tab but it doesn't work. :poly142:
Hah, yeah Ballo, I actually had the same issue on the same thing for the same comp, silly marmoset. In the end I just manually rotated my meshes to get a decent result, but it's still no turntable for on my portfolio
Rendering the Scene, even if the lights are parented to the sky still results in the lights rotating around the along with the mesh, meaning that within a few shots I start getting the rimlight in the front! grah!
I noticed you guys didn't put in this shortcut key on your .pdf manual, doc or i missed it.
Cntl + shift + p, i stumbled upon it trying to play the Turn Table and say t was the option for what i wanted.
I get a weird shadowing with local reflections idk if that was mentioned but it looks like a sss/noise map of some kind. (idk that is what it looks like to me and i see almighty_gir might be talking about the same thing, not sure.)
Really just wanted to mention that shortcut if anyone cared to know there you go.
Hey EQ I have a feature request which is more of a physically inspired workflow. After working with metalness maps and albedo maps for a while now both at work and in toolbag 2 I'm actually finding the auto darkening the metalness map provides to be counter intuitive. It's great when you're making pure metal materials that don't use textures, but in practice I find clean chrome, silver, and gold to be the minority of materials I create.
I'd rather tune my albedo's colour and brightness at the same time in a single map rather than adjust metalness and then adjust albedo to compensate. Could I get a toggle switch in toolbag 2 which disables the metalness map darkening the albedo, but leaves everything else in the pbr workflow the same.
On a side note I just attended a local siggraph presentation on kill zone shadow fall and they don't even use a metalness map which was interesting. I guess there's a lot of variation on the workflow between engines. They use an albedo where you make metals darker values, a specular brightness/colour map, and a roughness map.
Hey EQ I have a feature request which is more of a physically inspired workflow. After working with metalness maps and albedo maps for a while now both at work and in toolbag 2 I'm actually finding the auto darkening the metalness map provides to be counter intuitive. It's great when you're making pure metal materials that don't use textures, but in practice I find clean chrome, silver, and gold to be the minority of materials I create.
I'd rather tune my albedo's colour and brightness at the same time in a single map rather than adjust metalness and then adjust albedo to compensate. Could I get a toggle switch in toolbag 2 which disables the metalness map darkening the albedo, but leaves everything else in the pbr workflow the same.
On a side note I just attended a local siggraph presentation on kill zone shadow fall and they don't even use a metalness map which was interesting. I guess there's a lot of variation on the workflow between engines. They use an albedo where you make metals darker values, a specular brightness/colour map, and a roughness map.
Metalness maps have little/nothing to do with PBR really, its just a different way to pack the content. If you don't want to work with the metalness workflow, just use a standard color specular map. Metalness maps are not "more pbr" than full color specular, they're just more efficient as you can pack them into an 8bit channel. You can do what you're asking for already and the standard shader works that way out of the box. You can also turn off energy conservation as well, but then you're not really working with a PBR system anymore.
I still like everything the metalness map does, I just don't want it to auto darken my albedo that's all. I find it easier to tune the darkness of the albedo for the metal bits by hand in the same map rather than brightening the albedo then brightening the metalness and kind of doing a dance back and forth between two maps to find the right amount of diffuse light contribution for a piece of metal.
I still like everything the metalness map does, I just don't want it to auto darken my albedo that's all. I find it easier to tune the darkness of the albedo for the metal bits by hand.
If you don't auto-darken the diffuse, you're no longer using a metalness map. The whole concept of the metalness map is that metalics do not have diffuse lighting (they do but like less than 1%), so you store only the specular intensity/color in the albedo. If you have say a .75 diffuse value your material is not going to read as metallic anymore.
You can try this out with the standard color spec workflow, set your diffuse value and your spec value to the same color, and turn off energy conservation. You'll find you're not able to make metalic looking materials this way.
Replies
-Most paints are Polyurethane, which has a similar reflectance of plastic, plexiglass, and some glass.
-This range in Hue/Saturate/Brightness is mostly between ~22% and ~24% or 25% brightness. In Hex, between 393939 and 3e3e3e. These are just gray colors, in gamma space.
-You can add some color for a "colored" plastic specular, but keep your brightness around the same range.
Here, have some swatches for Photoshop I made! https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/8510078/Colors%20for%20Physically%20Based%20Shading.aco
Reed
Top row is default toolbag2 with gloss settings .95, .75, .5, and the bottom row is the GGX type specular shape with the same gloss settings.
Oh ok so there are only those ways, thanks a lot!
Yeah this is the best way to do it for now.
We do not currently support traditional soft alpha blending, because it has so many technical issues (with sorting, and differed rendering stuff that we do).
ah, interesting suggestion, i'll try that out...
As a side note, here's a little video showing some of the shader changes i've made. It shows the default blinn-phong shape for Toolbag2, and then the GGX shape used by UE4/The Order 1866, and finally a Beckmann skin specular shape:
[ame="
I've looked online aswel but haven't been able to find anything. Is there any future plans to incorporate something like this? Or is it already here and i'm totally missing something?
Thanks!
At the moment i don't believe toolbag supports lighting channels the way UDK does. would be a nice feature though!
essentially though, what you'll see is an overall softer reflection, with a longer "tail" to any reflective hotspots. you can see in the images i posted above, there is a tail even at the highest glossiness, while blinn-phong is a very "tight" reflection shape.
[edit:] I opened up the files, and tried to somehow hope to magically understand what I needed to do, and also looked up the equations for GGX specular distribution; scratched my head for a minute, and closed the file.
[edit:] Also tried to enable masking the Newton Rings. 0 for 2. Maybe I should try to learn how to edit these things before attempting to edit them, ha...
i'm also trying to figure out if i can make them toggleable as shader types (i can, but it means locking out existing types at the moment).
right now i'm trying to make the IBL portion of the skin specular sync up with the point light part, at the moment its glossiness doesn't blur out at the right rate.
http://crazyferretstudios.com/public/reflection.zip
DISCLAIMER: this is in no way affiliated with Marmoset.co, and is entirely unsupported both by them and by myself. Loading this shader is done of your own choice and any adverse performance in toolbag should be recognised as a result of that choice.
INSTRUCTIONS: this is very important, you must browse to: Marmoset Toolbag 2\data\shader\mat\reflection and then rename "directPhong.frag" to "directPhong_backup.frag". This is because toolbag currently reads specific file names for its shaders, and you want to make sure you keep the old one so you can revert back but also make sure it isn't read by toolbag.
Then drop the "directPhong.frag" and "GGX_calcs.frag" from the zip into the same folder as above. when you load toolbag next you will have the GGX specular shape for lights.
it's important to note that this doesn't affect the way IBL works at all. i'm working on that but there are a couple of roadblocks i've got to overcome and i'm quite busy right now. however the default toolbag IBL is close enough that you probably wouldn't see the difference.
I'm trying to do some turntables to my character but I have an issue with Scene turntable mode. I just want to rotate the model and keep my lighting, but when I export my turntable, Skylight position changes. Any thought? Thanks
also make sure to use "scene turntable" only and set camera and sky turntable to 0
if you have any custom lights make sure to parent all lights under the sky.
Edit: I tried, it looks doesn't work.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/13288045/turntable.tbscene
just to clarify, you can have any custom rotation to the sky but under the animation tab the sky needs to be set to 0 since all you need for the turntable is the scene rotation/turntable (sky wont move when you just use scene turntable)
From the image export settings panel (ctrl+p) you can set the turntable type to scene, camera, or sky, and use the clockwise checkbox to set which direction it goes in.
There was an issue with the sky jumping on turntable export, but that should have been fixed. Ballo, if you could check to make sure that is happening, and tell me which turntable export settings you're using that would be great. If you can get me a scene that shows the issue I may be able to give you some sort of solution in the meantime.
What MM has suggested should work, in my experience at least.
That is what is happening to me. For example, on MM file(thanks!) when I export still images sky rotation change from 140 to 239/240, more or less. Same that happened to me at my file.
I'm just using default settings, with 2.03.
Thanks again.
I have highlighted the problem area in red. The mesh is using a simple default material, with no normal map, and looks fine inside Maya's view port.
Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.
you are right, i didnt bother to check the actual rendered files to see if the sky matched the settings and it seems it doesnt match viewport settings.
i would call this a bug.
I'm getting some bad transparency artifacts when rendering out turntables
would really like some idea as to what's happening
I believe it has to do with the local reflections because rendering with local reflections off gives me no problems
I would like to see this fixed as those reflections are very pretty
Reed
my render outputs lighting doesn't match that of my viewport
any idea as to why this is happening?
Ideally in your AO map. If you don't have a seperate one put it (as white) in your metalness map so your diffuse is black and it uses your albedo for the spec, then make it black in your albedo as well.
Sorry for the spam, I fixed my issue, it was my fault
panning and zooming, even just being able to key the camera would be great
Rendering the Scene, even if the lights are parented to the sky still results in the lights rotating around the along with the mesh, meaning that within a few shots I start getting the rimlight in the front! grah!
Cntl + shift + p, i stumbled upon it trying to play the Turn Table and say t was the option for what i wanted.
I get a weird shadowing with local reflections idk if that was mentioned but it looks like a sss/noise map of some kind. (idk that is what it looks like to me and i see almighty_gir might be talking about the same thing, not sure.)
Really just wanted to mention that shortcut if anyone cared to know there you go.
I'd rather tune my albedo's colour and brightness at the same time in a single map rather than adjust metalness and then adjust albedo to compensate. Could I get a toggle switch in toolbag 2 which disables the metalness map darkening the albedo, but leaves everything else in the pbr workflow the same.
On a side note I just attended a local siggraph presentation on kill zone shadow fall and they don't even use a metalness map which was interesting. I guess there's a lot of variation on the workflow between engines. They use an albedo where you make metals darker values, a specular brightness/colour map, and a roughness map.
Metalness maps have little/nothing to do with PBR really, its just a different way to pack the content. If you don't want to work with the metalness workflow, just use a standard color specular map. Metalness maps are not "more pbr" than full color specular, they're just more efficient as you can pack them into an 8bit channel. You can do what you're asking for already and the standard shader works that way out of the box. You can also turn off energy conservation as well, but then you're not really working with a PBR system anymore.
If you don't auto-darken the diffuse, you're no longer using a metalness map. The whole concept of the metalness map is that metalics do not have diffuse lighting (they do but like less than 1%), so you store only the specular intensity/color in the albedo. If you have say a .75 diffuse value your material is not going to read as metallic anymore.
You can try this out with the standard color spec workflow, set your diffuse value and your spec value to the same color, and turn off energy conservation. You'll find you're not able to make metalic looking materials this way.