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Dastansdream
09-07-2011, 03:02 PM
Hey guys,
I try to create polygonal hair for my character(without alpha-planes).
But i am very new to modeling i dont really know how to start it, are there any good tutorials?

A good example of the hair ,how i would like to create it, is KIngdom Hearts.
Example: http://images.wikia.com/kingdomhearts/images/4/41/Zexion_Days.png




BTW: Is it really that important that the vertices of the hair and the vertices of the head are linked to each other?

( I am using 3Ds Max)

Vailias
09-07-2011, 05:01 PM
no its not important that the verts be linked, just make sure they're all skinned to the same bones when you get to rigging.

Since you're new to modeling here's the best, most useful tutorial I know of:

Observe. Try. repeat.

There is no magic formula or set of steps to make that hair, or any hair, or any thing. Just observe what the result you want is, use the tools you have to approach it and evaluate your results, and adjust your work as best you can.

Almost all the detail in that guys hair is in the texture, the actual strands are just modeled out in strips.

Dastansdream
09-08-2011, 09:37 AM
Thank you for the answer.^^

I really tried it , I tried to extrude the hair from the head, I tried it like in the "Joan of Arc" tutorial and I even tried it with alpha-planes.

Alpha-planes:

http://img820.imageshack.us/img820/7718/alphaplanes.png

But that doesn't give me the "Cartoon/Anime/unrealistic" look that i want.
Everytime without reasonable results.


And besides, I have every time the feeling, that I do it incredibly wrong.

melviso
09-08-2011, 10:13 AM
Don't use alpha maps.If u want the hair to be cartoony,just use hair strand textures on the color map,maybe add normal map so that the hair stands stand out,don't make the normal map too detailed(many hair stands).Just keep it light.

Mark Dygert
09-08-2011, 10:14 AM
In the case of the above example if you're trying to get it like the image in your original post, the material, not the mesh is what is letting you down. It's overly complicated and missing the subtle gradient from dark to light.

There are a few ways to get that gradient.

You can uniquely unwrap each strand and paint the gradient into the texture.
You can use the same strand copied over and over and use vertex paint to tint each strand differently.
You can create a few strands with various darkness and use them where needed.

Anyway you go you need to work on blocking in the big forms and defining shapes.

Dastansdream
09-08-2011, 12:45 PM
Thank you both, i will need the techniques after i did the mesh.

But my current problem is still that i dont get a good mesh ,it ends every time in a complete mess.

Bruno Afonseca
09-08-2011, 12:58 PM
Don't give up, it's a tricky thing to do. Just keep observing and trying out. Look how layered this kingdom hearts hair is, lower layers are darker than the upper layers. That helps giving it a bit of structure and defining the shapes a lil better. Otherwise it'd look messy!

Why don't you try making a single strand with no texture, just a vertex color gradient and placing copies of it in a head? Maybe that could help you understand the structure of it, the direction the hair grows, the weight of the strands etc.

Dastansdream
09-09-2011, 12:40 PM
Thanks fonfa, that really helped me. ^^

That is how far I am right now, I didnt get that much strands in the Hair, but its my first "working" try.

http://img691.imageshack.us/img691/9683/hairsofar.png


Did i something important wrong so far?

Elyaradine
09-10-2011, 02:54 AM
That's coming along nicely. :)

I don't think the shape is quite right. I'd add a few planes on the side of his head to hide bits of skin that wouldn't be there in a normal hairline (it's too far up I think, especially near the front), and add a bit of a curve to some of the straight strands you've got there.

Ouija
09-10-2011, 04:56 AM
Add at least one more layer. Single layer hairstyles tend to look cheap, bad and should be used only in lowpoly.

Visceral
09-10-2011, 06:42 AM
I wouldnt keep the hair in a single object like that. I would split it up like in the following tutorial.

http://www.paultosca.com/varga_hair.html

making the hair from your reference to me seems very simple since you are working with such a simple alpha. no need for individual straws of hair.

Dastansdream
09-10-2011, 09:23 AM
That's coming along nicely. :)

I don't think the shape is quite right. I'd add a few planes on the side of his head to hide bits of skin that wouldn't be there in a normal hairline (it's too far up I think, especially near the front), and add a bit of a curve to some of the straight strands you've got there.

Ok IŽll do that.^^



I wouldnt keep the hair in a single object like that. I would split it up like in the following tutorial.

http://www.paultosca.com/varga_hair.html

making the hair from your reference to me seems very simple since you are working with such a simple alpha. no need for individual straws of hair.

Thanks,but alpha-planes dont look like the cartoon-style I want.


Add at least one more layer. Single layer hairstyles tend to look cheap, bad and should be used only in lowpoly.


I dont know exactly what you mean.To extrude some more strands from higher up?

throttlekitty
09-10-2011, 01:53 PM
Ok IŽll do that.^^
I dont know exactly what you mean.To extrude some more strands from higher up?

In your last image, the hair is more or less one big shell with some spiky bits, but there aren't any layers. Go back to the original reference image you posted, draw what you think the wireframe looks like on top of that image.

Dastansdream
09-13-2011, 04:58 PM
Sorry for the late reply, but i wasnŽt home a few days.

In your last image, the hair is more or less one big shell with some spiky bits, but there aren't any layers. Go back to the original reference image you posted, draw what you think the wireframe looks like on top of that image.

Ok , i think i know what you mean.

I tried it to give it a second layer.(still as a single object)
But i looks pretty bad, would it be smarter to model a second layer as a different object and "put it over" the first one?Or any other tips?

Bruno Afonseca
09-13-2011, 05:50 PM
It can be a bunch of "ribbons" floating over the head, doesn't need to be solid like that! If you put enough of them, the hair will have volume and look good. Like this:

http://fc07.deviantart.net/fs70/f/2011/233/9/8/rubi_malone_low_poly_wires_by_hyperdivine-d47f0hj.jpg

(found on http://www.polycount.com/forum/showthread.php?t=87907)

Vailias
09-13-2011, 07:27 PM
I think you're more than halfway there. The form is fine for the tooned look you want.

What you're missing the aesthetic execution.
Spend some time observing hair.
The most important parts to getting people to buy textured hair are the specularity, and the depth.

Paint some hair in just 2d for practice. As in find a picture of a real person who's hair you like, and do your best to paint that in photoshop. Look at your results, then see where you can improve it.

A few specific things for painting hair:
The diffuse color of it is similar to how metal is painted. Start dark, layer over with light. Paint the highlights in rather than painting the shadows.

Hair, as a mass, exhibits anisotropic specular highlighting. So you'll have shiny bands against the grain/lay of the hair where the light hits.
If you're going for the painted look, paint this in, and turn your shader's specular off.
Also notice that the hair strands tend to get bright and highly saturated near the highlight area, but a little outside of it.
Many of the shadows in hair also carry more saturation with them than you'll find in solid objects.

All this is due to individual hairs being translucent, and internally refractive.
Sometimes light travels down the hair before being re-emitted, giving its characteristic glow. Deeper hairs can be lit by light which has passed through the upper layers, giving more of that saturated look.
Here's some direct ref:
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/442934/PC_Links/AnnotatedHair.jpg

For low poly painted hair like you're wanting, you're going to just have to bring the look you want artistically. Straight up paint the hair out.
Start with a saturated shadow color, so you have a little room at the bottom, and a LOT of room in the highlights.
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/442934/PC_Links/hair_Paintover1.png


1.) Block out your major strand areas with a deeper desaturated shadow. These are going to be the borders of your overhanging layers of hair.

2.)Choose a middle bright and moderately saturated variety of the color of the hair. Mass in the large volumes of how the hair sits on the head. For diffuse only characters a general light from above works well.

3.) Choose your highlight color. Something in the overall spectrum of the hair color, very close to white but not pure white (unless you're doing black hair.. but even then a subtle blue or brown cast works better) Block in the major areas of highlight. Go a little larger than the end highlight you actually want.

4.) choose your "true color" for your hair. This is the brightest and most saturated version of the hair color. Paint it in subtly around the highlights along the grain of the hair, but don't stray too far from the core of the highlight. This adds significant life and body to the hair.

5.) Go in with a small round brush, often 1 pixel works well, and add some flyaways. Little bits of hair that are separate from the main group, or small groups to themselves and catch light on their own away from the main mass highlight. Deepen the shadows in the most unlit areas, and take your small round brush and add some more internal shadowing to the hair masses. You don't need to go all the way down a hair mass, and indeed shouldn't. This is adding more life and visual complexity to the hair.

Often less is more here. :) Overdoing the individual strands makes the end product look like scribbles, but some internal shadowing and breaking up of the hair forms is essential for it to read as hair.