Dominance War II - indian_boy

[indian_boy]

thought i might try out for this competition, so im reserving my spot...

have a basic idea of what i want to do, it involves big and bulky, and his speciality is "secure an opening for my team's gathering fleets." /images/graemlins/crazy.gif

[Emil Mujanovic]

Good to have you on board dude!
Good luck with the comp.

-caseyjones

[indian_boy]

thanks...

well... as for now i've got a 'concept' ready (well... its more a collection of 3 orthos as i suck at proper sketching of perspectives and stuff). Made it in photoshop using a mouse [no tablet]:

----
[sorry for the big image size...]
http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/249c1e4d-orthos.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/249c1e4d-orthos/)
NAME: General Bayne Yu-Dye Nau
SPECIALITY: Assault
WEAPONS: Ion Gun "Lux" ; Dark Matter Gun "Nox" ; Ax [or] cricket bat (dont think i should do cricket bat...)
BACKSTORY:
As a young boy, Bayne [a Brit adopted to a Japanese family] had suffered a head injury that had caused him to suffer mental retardation. Unable to lead a normal life, he was sent to a "special" institute after his parents were assured that everything would be safe. The institute was nice... that much couldn't be denied. But when word spread that the Enemy was preparing an attack and after the institute came under military control; all kinds of inhumane experiments took place.
Bayne is the only of his kind. Under the experimental codename "Enemy of Intelligence," his head had been drilled, and two wires were used to send electrical shocks into the Frontal Lobe of his cerebrum. The current had the desired effects: the neurons in charge of "Logic" and "Common Sense" were completely numbed. This massive hulk was now unable to fear and cower. He... "it" didn't stop the augments from being added to his body which allowed him to carry extreme weights. It didn't mind having his heart replaced by another, stronger one... it didn't mind having parts of his brain exanged by the brains of former Generals. It even didn't mind having parts of his body replaced my metal completely. And the painful 'reskinning' procedure was no problem for it. Living in complete isolation, Bayne was able to hone his skills as the skin slowly began to grow on his body. He became accustomed to wearing his heavy leg armour, and still being able to charge down a mile in less than a minute.
Then, only three years after the rumours... the war began. Though his skin wasn't completely healed, and some other procedures were still remaining, Bayne was released into the battlefield, to wreak havok on all that stood before him.

-----

i was a bit crazy wit the backstory... but is it any good?

[gauss]

hey there indian_boy--

first of all, it turns out that i'm probably going to come to India after all--so hopefully, if everything works out, we can sit down for a little drawing session one on one, and i can help you out with your entry or other projects in a more direct way.
but until that happens, and it'll definitely be a while (at least several weeks), let's talk about what you've got going on here.
your backstory is alright; i'm glad to see you thinking about history, about why the character is the way he is. that's great. what isn't so great is the ortho, which really doesn't have a whole lot of information to go on. i know you don't have a tablet, which makes things tough, but you should definitely be busting out the old pencil and paper and working out some interesting designs that way.
also, in terms of the character you have now and the backstory--be sure to visit dominancewar.com again and read the briefing more carefully. i don't think an assault-type guy is going to fit the criteria all that well; you'll probably need to make him into more of a surgical, precise sort of fighter. but he is powerful, which is an element that you'll want to retain.
so keep working at it--you've got a good start, but as i've been telling everyone else, quick sketches and thumbnails are a good way to keep your options open and find your best idea, not just your first.

[indian_boy]

yes sir general gauss sir!

honestly though, thanks for ur response. always helpful! i have, in fact, just done a few pencil doodles (none are too good yet) which i guess i should pay more attention to?
also, i've made 'suitable' changes to the guy to fit the sharp-shooter range *more on this below.*
once again: thanks... and i look forward to seeing u (plz don't come in march... i have finals and it would be unfortunate if i got 'so close, yet so far' from meeting ya).

---

okay, made a few changes to the orthos.. these will probably be the last ones for a while as i'll try pencilling out the character now.
[only front view]
http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/430be938-orthos02.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/430be938-orthos02/)
how are the irrelevant glowy bits?

a few changes to the character to suit the specs.
- arm augments include small gears that become active whenever a gun is unholstered. these gears aid in reducing recoil (if he's "going in" or, if he's discovered, and he needs to use the afformentioned Ion/dark matter guns).
- Alternatively, when using his sniper rifle, these gears along with the microprocessor in the arm are able to calculate minutest of movements, and cancel them out. Breathing doesn't ruin THIS guys aim!
- i am designing a slide-over helmet with thermal + night vision
- leg augments help carry extreme weights while still being quiet. He's not too quiet though (that'd be unfair).

how is it turning out?
thanks in advance...

[indian_boy]

okay... i'm actually studying science at the moment, but an idea just struck me as i sit in front of my 'internet only' computer.
so i turned on MS Paint, and tried to represent this idea. ill do it later using Photoshop, but how is the 'silhouette' looking. it still needs some work, but im keepin' it simple for now...
http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/d7b73cee-Sliber.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/d7b73cee-Sliber/) http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/20186513-Sliber.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/20186513-Sliber/)
[im aware that these aren't pencil sketches, and i guess i went too far again?]

[indian_boy]

okay, now i've done a few pen/cil sketches, and im gonna post them up before i go to bed. there were many ideas, and i've thrown away hundreds of pieces of paper (i think i can score 3-pointers now)... but these three (2 really) were my favorites so far...
first off is a modified version of the same character:
http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/20d849c9-Sliber.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/20d849c9-Sliber/)
kinda' looks like the guy in the post just above... made him a bit sleeker, and changed his armour.

and then there is this one:
http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/b77f3366-Sliber.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/b77f3366-Sliber/)
i think i'm starting to like this one more and i might move away from the bulky human. go for the sleek alien look instead? i might do this character if i don't get an even better idea... as i try to sleep tonight, i can bet ill come up with an 'interesting' story for this guy (its in progress at the mo'.)

so any suggestions, comments, crits would be awesome... hoping to wake up tomorrow to see a handful of responses that i can use to work off of.

thanks!
good night...

[indian_boy]

okay... that... wasn't... ummm... ahrgh, watever:

well, i was doing some more sketches and stuff this morning, none were really nice, and i just couldn't get my mind off of the alien above. So i started adding some rough details, and thinking out some stuff about him, and i think i'll be doing him for the contest. So, i took out my 'official' sketch-book, and began the planning... following below are the new sketches, and pointers about this character... if by 1900hrs {indian standard time} i do not get any complaints on this guy... i'll be submitting him as a thumbnail etc. etc...

-----------

http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/ba39ca2b-Sliber.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/ba39ca2b-Sliber/)
NAME: Kanchchh Igliksk
GENDER:Unknown
AGE:Unknown
WEAPONS: Retractable blade, Ion Gun (lux) Dark Matter Gun (nox), Sniper Rifle (caedo)
BACKSTORY:
On returning to his home planet from a distant solar system (as a part of his initiation into adulthood) Kanchchh discovered that everything was destroyed. Using the psi ablities that are a part of his race, he communicated with the lost souls of the destroyed system. What he learned, angered him beyond the anger of even the gods! In a war over 50 years past, a certain "CGChat" had destroyed some "Polycount" planets in the system. The resulting explosions had wiped out the entire solar system, leaving it with a Half-Sun orbited by rocks.
In his rage, Kanchchh flew to the homeplanet of Polycount, the Emperors of the Stars, and swore an oath of fealty to them. He expressed his desire to aid in the destruction of CGChat (rumors spread that they were preparing for another war) but he was denied. The Emperors claimed that his body wasn't suited for the task, he was too weak, and he was incapable of helping. He would only be a burden in the war...
A determined Kanchchh, however, spent the next 50 years of his life in isolation, slowly modifying and improving his body using his knowledge of the "Life Sciences" and "The Energies."
The next time he presented himself to the Emperors, they were impressed by his determination and his new abilities, and allowed Kanchchh to become a Shadow in the new war that had started only days ago.
Kanchchh has only one objective now: to ensure that all enemies of Polycount (particularly CGChat) are destroyed. He will ensure that, for generations to come, enemies of Polycount will tremble in fear at the mention of his name... He will have his vengance... and more!

-----

particular information and major pointers/features of Kanchchh will come up in the next post... after i've planned them out better...

once again... any c&c is welcome... please... /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[indian_boy]

http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/2b28bcca-alien02.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/2b28bcca-alien02/)
used photoshop to ink the outlines... i realised that they weren't too easy to see... oh... and i bumped the thread /images/graemlins/crazy.gif

---
no just kidding!
SALIENT FEATURES OF THE SHADOW:
- using knowledge of biology, and their extensive understanding of their own bodies, Kanchchh has been able to modify his bone growth. eg. he now has an external ribcage aswell, along with an external shin-guard. He has modified other parts into potential weapons (i will make knuckle bones jut out, and some parts will be spiky). Plus, his right lower arm bones have been modified into a weapon.
- he has made an internal link between his lungs, thoracic cavity and arms. The movement caused by his breathing is automatically countered by his muscles (steadiest aim ever for a sharp shooter).
- the small pipe entering his chest is connected to a Cell mounted on his back. it is linked to his heart, and his brain (i'll show the back view later) and it increases the rate and efficiency of the activities carried out.
- being a noctunal being, his eyes can see perfectly in darkness, however, if he is needed during daylight, then he has retractable 'day-vision' goggles. Attached to these are also thermal vision goggles.
- The back of his head has an extra organ (the second brain) which is covered in bone. This second brain is wat allows these creatures to talk, through telepathy. It also gives them slight telekinetic abilities.
- I'll add some metal on top of this bone. This metal piece will be used in case Kanchchh gets captured. He simply has to trigger the thought, and immedieately the bone and second brain will be crushed by the metal. This way, even extensive torturing couldn't extract information. Repairing this damage takes only a few months (after Kanchchh has already gained so much experience that is...)

that's all for now... more as they pop into my head!

[gavku]

good to see you nutting this out.....make sure to develop further the head etc, or when you come to actually build this guy, it will be a pain making up details that fit in well with the overall design...

[indian_boy]

thanks for the tip gavku...

well, since there have been no negative crits in so many hours, i've decided to take the plunge with this character... title = Kanchchh Igliksk

well, anyways... this is my base, then, and now i'll try to really figure out each part of him before i get to modelling...

as of now, i'll ask again:
how's the concept?
and add a new question:
how's the skin colour looking? :
http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/cd21aa05-alien03.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/cd21aa05-alien03/)

[Shady-D]

hmm looks good so far i geuss.. I was actually liking the fat dude.
Blue is refreshing but try a daring color, a color no1 would try.. Yellow or something

[indian_boy]

u preferred the fat dude? hmm... i guess i'll be making him in the future... i liked him too, so i definately won't be getting rid of him entirely...
as for yellow... it seems slighly impractical for the purpose of a Shadow. I even need to darken the blue i think! or add a layer of gray on top of it...

well, apart from that, i've coloured in the bones and stuff, and im posting it up again as i try to figure out how to make glows like Rawkstar in his concept sketch...
also working on a head idea... i have it looking awesome in my head.. let's c if i can translate it with a pencil!
http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/a308c192-alien04.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/a308c192-alien04/)
any c and c is awesome,
thanks

[Em.]

looks cool so far, good shapes, agreed with shady, try playing with different skin colors, never know what might look awesome. Then again, I'm sure you'll be painting more contrast and shadows into it, so we'll see. I like the ribcage vest kinda thing. It'll be easier to crit as you get further into the details, keep going!

[indian_boy]

thanks ogle...
i guess ill try out some other colours later on... but is there a way to replace a whole range of colours with another range easily?
ie. one click will make all dark blues into dark browns and light blues into light browns and everything in between

now, sorry to practically double post, and i know it seems like im just watching my thread, but i had to post up my 'head' idea: (perspective and stuff is kinda' screwy....)
http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/01e682b2-headSketch.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/01e682b2-headSketch/)
this is the head when the mouth is closed. seeing that we have 6k polies to work with, i'm gonna make the inside of the mouth 'special.' he will have a second layer of all-canine upper teeth, and the lower jaw will split apart sideways to reveal them. Apart from this, he will also have 3 sucker-mouths dangling inside of his mouth. Trying to draw that is a real pain at the mo'... but if i can't draw it, i'll at least figure out how to model it.

so how's the head? looking for any c and c on it, and the previous posts too... thanks

[Emil Mujanovic]

I've been meaning to post in your thread, and now I'm going to /images/graemlins/smile.gif
I really like the second last concept (blue and off-white). I think there is some potential there to make an awesome character. I think at this stage it is looking a little generic in the silhouette. If you were to colour the whole thing in black, it would pretty much look like a human man with a strange shaped head.
I've done a really crap paintover (mainly using the the liquify filter to pull out shapes and move things around). I've even done 2 really quick and random silhouettes to show you even the smallest things could improve the shape. The one under the 2 is just the base silhouette, feel free to use that and paint over it a few times to come up with your own ideas.
http://www.itsonlikedonkeykong.net/polycount/domwar2/paintovers/indianboy-po.gif

Hope this helps you push your ideas a bit more, the key is to experiment as much as you can while still in the concept stage. Keep at it dude.

-caseyjones

[indian_boy]

thanks, caseyjones, for taking the time out to make a paint-over. and despite what u think, it ain't crappy.
funny thing is that, after reading the comment, i filled in the whole thing in black, and when my mom walked in and saw, she was like: "Head is waay wrong! looks like the man got smacked by a hammer"
so, u are right about that too! now i'm working on changing about the silhouette and adding more features... after working at it some, and bringing in the new head, here's what i've got:

http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/05921112-alien05.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/05921112-alien05/)
keep the comments and crits coming... doesn't matter if they aren't 7 paragraphs long... cuz:
[ QUOTE ]
even the smallest things could improve the shape

[/ QUOTE ]
where things are comments, and shape is concept/model/tex etc.
/images/graemlins/smile.gif
thanks!

[Dave_Hingley]

hi i been meaning to post yesterday

design is looking nice i like the colour scheme you have going on the desing reminds me a little of lord z out of power rangers
i like the 'hammered' head it makes it more alien. you get the impression that its more violent I guess your shadow is humanoid but not a human

[indian_boy]

i had the same thoughts Dave... i think i _will_ use the hammered head. Just need to make some modifications on it to make it "nicer." thanks for the comment...

on another note, i had sketched up the gun this morning, but i didn't post it cuz i didn't want to ruin the flow of this thread, ie: all character concept first, then all weapon concept etc. etc.
then i realized that that is simply stupid! so i'm gonna post up the sketches i'd made, and i wanna know what u guys think:

http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/4567a631-Sliber.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/4567a631-Sliber/)
[sniper rifle]
i'll post details about the gun tomorrow, cuz now my eyes are droopy and i'm not thinking right... as of now, the only thing i'm sure about the gun is that, if it could talk, it would say, "small bullet-holes are for wussies!" /images/graemlins/crazy.gif and i'd like it to stay that way... so i'm definately not "small-ifying" the gun.

so: lookin' for c and c on the sniper rifle, and the previous posts aswell!
thanks guys.

[indian_boy]

bumping it for now... i'll post some updates later in the day... i wanna see some crits if i can... please... thanks u...
----
http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/dc210d21-Sliber.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/dc210d21-Sliber/)
update on the drawing...
i think i only changed the head here...
more updates soon! (May even begin modelling the gun?)

any c and c is welcome!

[gauss]

hi there. let's get right to business, eh?
first off, stop using that fuzzy brush, in whatever package you're painting in. unless you want to show that your character is meant to be seen in soft focus all the time, or is covered in very short fur all over, use a hard-edged brush from now on. it might take a little getting used to, but you need to be more decisive in placing lines, more confident--even if it comes off sketchier.
and on the subject of sketching, what have i been saying about concepts and marriage? okay, so you realized your first girlfriend was ugly, but then you went out and bought the next girl a diamond engagement ring--what gives?
you need to stop indulging your tendency to do the zoom-ins and the call-outs and the special detailing; all that good stuff should come much later. once you started on this vaguely predator looking fellow, you've been honing details, when the larger, more fundamental aspects of the character are completely undecided--you should still be doing thumbnails. little doodles. not silhouettes, but little doodles of cool looking guys.
and another thing to restrain: write your stories later. now is not the time; we're artists, not writers, and ultimately the quality of our work will always be judged on its visual presentation, no matter how much we've thought it out and written out those clever little ideas for his spike-shooter or jetpack or alien mouth-parts. the backstory and the naming and all that, much like the visual detailing, can and should come later.
think of it like sculpture: what does a sculptor do? before he even gets carving or chiseling at his wood or stone or whatever, he first makes sure he's got decent materials. does it make any sense to grab a piece of wood and immediately start carving out a hand, only to look up and realize the wood's rotting at one end, and not nearly big enough for what you want to carve?
that's what i'm talking about. you need to set your priorities straight for how you go about conceptualizing the character. yeah, i know it seems like holding off the fun parts, and to some degree it is... but it isn't necessarily. forcing yourself to make sure the good stuff is there, very early on, before any detail shots or backstory or whatever, means the rest of the process won't be a headache. repeat after me: garbage in, garbage out /images/graemlins/smile.gif don't start with garbage if you want to end up with gold! /images/graemlins/laugh.gif

so here's your assignment, mr indian. do 12 thumbnails, each only a few centimenters tall--and only give yourself a minute per thumbnail drawing. i'm serious about that, get a watch or clock handy and make yourself draw one-minute character sketches. after you've done the 12 in 12 minutes, and think you dont have any other quick little character sketches left, do 12 more. then you'll start getting something good--you've got to mine for the gold. don't pick up whatever comes up first and then start refining it; it's lost effort.

so there you go.. hope that's martial enough advice for you /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[indian_boy]

sir yes sir!
now i've got to rip that girl's finger off and get that ring back!

wait, i've got a few questions:
1)if i use a hard brush, how do i get colour blending to happen? (i use photoshop CS2)
2) @ gauss in particular: will u hurt me if i do less than 12?
3) if i were an alchemist, couldn't i change garbage to gold?
BUT, since i'm not an alchemist:
i am doing little doodles. unfortunately, only got time to do 7 (in 6 and something minutes) when my mom told me that i should study as i have a party to attend to"night" and won't have time bla bla bla...
anyways, thought i'd post up at least these... see wat types of comments i get...
http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/de833b35-scan.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/de833b35-scan/)
NOTE: after a while (like right away really), i kinda' started doing only wolf legs, which might seem annoying to some.
NOTE2: i personallly don't like "4"...

so.... gun me down! be ruthless!

[Mark Dygert]

Gauss you're awesome in case no one has said thank you for being such a big part of this war effort, thank you. Your comments and your attitude are inspiring and helpful.

Indian_boy, it keeps getting better and better, Gauss is whippin' you into shape and its paying off.

3 looks like your best bet at this point but I would say if you have a few more thumbs left in you, your best one might be in that next bunch. Its the law of artists, your greatest piece is the one you do next. With as much as you keep improving I really think 1-2 more rounds of quickies would get something really solid, and you would say "yeah thats the one" instead of "I'm not too hot about 4".

Nothing wrong with wolf legs, they might be over used in bad guy characters but its a signature of evil. Polycount is evil so there ya go, one step closer.

Consider posture. Quite a few of your thumbs have the same proud, chest out posture not a bad thing at all. Evil henchmen and underlings often have bad posture (lack of a good health plan I guess). You might want to think about trying out a few thumbs who are hunched or more in a predatory mode.

I would try making #3 in a hunched pose with larger attack spikes that come around the front farther. Kind of like Manga Spawn (http://www.spawn.com/toys/product.aspx?product=2326), a carnifex (http://us.games-workshop.com/games/40k/tyranids/catalog/images/carnifex.jpg) or spider legs. Right now they aren't that imposing and would only be able to hit what he bear hugs.

I think you're close to nailing something down and I think by the end of the weekend you'll be ready to start modeling. Keep up the good work, its paying off =)

[indian_boy]

yes Gauss is awesome... i even awarded him with a prize here (http://boards.polycount.net/showthreaded.php?Cat=0&Number=180240&page=0&vc=1)! hope u like it Gauss!

thank you, Vig, for ur pointers and the references... always helpful! i see what u'r saying about #3's shoulder spikes... will definately get something with those babies in a more threatening position!
as of now, i think i've become an anti-social element! i was at the party last night, and i hardly talked to anybody or stuff (they weren't my friends or anything... just my dad's colleagues and their kids... so i wasn't obliged :| ) and just thought about the competiton.... is that a good thing?
lol, anyways... got home around 2 this morning and churned out 3 or 4 more thumbs before sleeping... this is what i got:
http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/a4fdafc8-Sliber.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/a4fdafc8-Sliber/)
now that i've seen you comment... i'll try to make some more with slightly hunched stances and stuff... but in this collection, i like number "9" (bottom middle)where i got the shoulder spikes bending under him and moving forward. I don't know if it looks a bit jumbled in the small sketch, but of all the thumbs so far, that's my fav. I'd just put in the lower legs from #3 of the first batch!
I'll c if i have any more shapes and forms that i could put on paper... but if i can't, i'm looking for comments and crits on these ones.

thanks to you all! and don't leave Gauss to all the whipping! don't u guys want a chance to whack me! bring in salt aswell! I don't mind...

[Shady-D]

he really.. really.. REALLY
reminds me of a generic halo soldier.. not good =/
Maybe the color scheme will change that
third thumb looks bad-ass btw

[indian_boy]

uh oh... generic? gotta do something about that!
third thumb refers to the #3 on the first batch?
cuz i personally like #9... blended with a #13 which i'll post up soon...
as of now, just bumping it... i was hoping for some more comments... want to gain some speed over here....

----
EDIT:
http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/fc30591e-thmbs03.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/fc30591e-thmbs03/)
i want to incorporate the back of #13 onto #9... i think it would look nice that way. btw: in 14, the back spikes are modified into jointed spikes...
so.... any c and c is good (as always)

[indian_boy]

okay, feeling kinda' guilty for bumping the thread, but i'm about to go to bed, and i just wanted the thread to be seen and commented on. i was hoping to get some comments and then move on to the "next stage". ie. get some bigger sketches and stuff in...etc. etc.
once again, sorry for the bump...!

[indian_boy]

okay,... so the bump was useless i guess...

anyways:
http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/c2b2e02c-Sliber.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/c2b2e02c-Sliber/)
i figured out what i wanted, and i'm starting to do it in phtoshop using a :gulp: hard brush only!
comments and crits please! even just a "hey dude, you suck" would be nice, just so i know people don't find it utterly boring (unless u post: "dude ur idea is so boring!")
thanks!

[Mark Dygert]

Now you're cookin with gas! I missed your other post and the bump this forum moves too fast sometimes for its own good. I like 14, be mindful of the spider-man-ish chest piece and the odd sizes between the legs, might just be a rushed thing or it could be on purpose?

I like the insect theme you have going that could play out pretty well in a few ways, the first that comes to my mind is the tyranids from Warhammer 40k. They have some pretty great boney plate armor references you might be able to pull from.

I like the arms/weapons on the back. For some reason I imagine him using them pierce and hold onto live prey as he travels, weird thought I know, don't ask me where it came from or how it got there...

Judging by the concepts you've laid out I think you have nailed down what you have in your head. Unless you aren't happy with it or someone else comes up with some pretty solid crits I don't see, I think you're ready to start modeling?

[Cridder]

I noticed that you have made a decission on your character, after reading the last couple post. Looking pretty good. Below I have answered some of your question it seemed other people didn't answer, or I didn't catch answering as I skimmed through the comments. I have also added my two bits worth of suggestions.
[ QUOTE ]
...try to figure out how to make glows like Rawkstar in his concept sketch...

[/ QUOTE ]
I dont know how Rawkstar makes his glows but when I make a glow in PhotoShop is I draw the part that I want to glow on one layer, give it the glow effect (double click on the layer to bring up layer styles) and after getting the colour, spred, and stuff were I want it with its editors I close it and the improve it with smug, blur, dodge/burn and liquify.

Another trick is to draw it out, duplicate the layer, play with the layer options (overlay, Colour Burn, Soft light, etc) and smug, blur, dodge/burn and liquify until I get the desired effect. This is alot easier if you have a table but is still possible with a mouse.
[ QUOTE ]
...is there a way to replace a whole range of colours with another range easily?

[/ QUOTE ]
There are aways, that is if all your colours for each part are on different layers. One is when on the layer go Image > Adjustments > Variations and mix colours until you get the colour you want. Second is select the layer, Ctrl+A, V, Arrow key Up then Down to put back into place. You just grabbed the colour's shape. Then make a new layer and use your pain bucket to full in the layer and play with your layer options to overlay if desired. And the last to to paint from scratch. Though this method takes time it usually by far looks the best.
[ QUOTE ]
he really.. really.. REALLY reminds me of a generic halo soldier..

[/ QUOTE ]
I would have to agree that your character when I first looked at him reminded me of Halo. but then again your Alien Character design is pretty cool, I personally would go with the thinner look that <font color="green">caseyjones</font> suggested. I like the backwards knee and the gun on one arm and I am guessing the hand blade on the other, though I personally think it would be better holding a gun so you dont run into over polying your character (a thought).

Here are my <u>suggestion</u> in a picture (hope you dont mind). If you like you can use them, other wise take it with a grain of sault /images/graemlins/smile.gif

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y226/Cridder/indianGuySuggestion.jpg

I notice you were fooling around with wings/jets/rockets I thought something more monsterous like bone wings, just a suggestion (Dont mind my WarHammer 40K infulance its a habbit). Also to pull away from the Halo style character try adding a tail. I tried adding a tail to some of your concepts and it looked pretty cool try it out and see if you like it. And I added a gun cause I notice besides your arm energy blade he lacked outside weaponry.

[indian_boy]

@ Vig: whoa!... ur thoughts about the back "arms" aren't weird... they're just like mine! [wait, in that case they r weird!]i'm glad somebody thought the same thing as me without me pointing it out! Also, i think i am being influenced by the tyranids subconciously (had a friend who used to collect the table top pieces...) I'll definately be looking them up for references further down the line!

@cridder: thanks for answering the questions... funny how even i forgot that i'd asked them! Other than that, i'm glad u liked the design, and i'd like to thank u for the sketch u did! After looking at the drawing, i think i wanna incorporate a tail, and maybe a few tubes (not precisely where u placed them though). Don't mind me not liking the wings, i want to try out the bony pincer-like thingies i've got going...

---
http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/b97662ba-Sliber.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/b97662ba-Sliber/)
update:
just slapped on some colours, gave him a holster (its the brown thing) for his close range gun, and added a _very_ rough tail idea. I'll add the huge sniper-rifle soon, and hope to god i can stay under-budget with everything.

any c and c is awesome... i felt awesome having two crits given in a row... w00t! (lol)
keep 'em coming! thanks in advance!

[indian_boy]

teh bump...
updates to come soon!

[indian_boy]

http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/7212f3e7-Sliber.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/7212f3e7-Sliber/)
added the sniper rifle... don't think i'll keep these colours... they don't match with his overall colouring...
thinking of starting the basemesh tomorrow? this feels like the direction i wanna go with... dont see anything stopping be so...

[indian_boy]

bump before i go to bed!:

buh-buh-buh-bump!

[indian_boy]

'k... so i just did a bit more on the drawing up there... didn't really feel inspired at the moment... thinking of going and making the basemesh? nobody really claimed to hate this idea... so... u can't stop me now!
http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/5dd99a8c-Sliber.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/5dd99a8c-Sliber/)
lol... okay, any and all c and c is welcome.

[gauss]

well before i forget, stop bumping. it's generally obnoxious practice in any forum, but particularly frowned upon here at polycount. you've got frequent enough updates to not have to resort to bumping--if people want to check out your thread, they'll find it /images/graemlins/smile.gif

and while "nobody really claimed to hate this idea," i would like to point out that even after i harped on you going back to the drawing board, you really didn't even try to play with any other ideas, now did you? you were married to this design before you even knew it. not that it's a problem here, i think this design will serve well enough for your entry, but just remember that for the next model you make. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

i agree that you look ready to tackle the basemesh. otherwise you'll just keep spamming away with tiny little changes to one picture, won't you? /images/graemlins/laugh.gif i wish you'd keep those earlier "hammered" helmet details though, those were my favorite design bit so far. in any case, get going on modeling so people can help you through the long road ahead. keep us posted, but remember, no bumping without proper updates!

[indian_boy]

right: basemesh!

keep in mind that the head and hand i haven't done cuz they r really difficult for me, i'll do them soon. i know i shouldn't post up an incomplete basemesh, but i know i have problems with meshflow and the like, so i'll need guidance here...
at the moment, symmetry is on, so i haven't made the shoulder piece or retractable blade... will do that later.
once again: i'm posting this to check if my mesh flow is good, among other things...
http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/3466d48a-01.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/3466d48a-01/)
thanks in advance!

edit: wow, gauss posts fast!
lol, okay i guess u r right... i didn't really deviate from the basic idea of the alien, im sorry... i guess i need to learn to be less commited! as for bumping, u r right... it is obnoxious, and i won't do it again... feelin' a little ticked at myself for bumping.
i will keep ur words in mind for my future models... i'm finding it kinda difficult... but i must take ur advice seriously... and i suppose i woulda kept spamming with little adjustments if i hadn't gone forward with the basemesh. /images/graemlins/laugh.gif

[indian_boy]

okay, made a bit of progress (kinda' happy at my speed really!) and i'm posting it up to get some feedback. I've added the tail, the hands, the "back-protrusions" and the head. The head, however, is not entirerly done yet.
http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/2954cd3b-02.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/2954cd3b-02/)
please guys, i need some confirmaiton on the meshflow, shape etc. etc. any feedback is good feedback.
Thanks!

[Snowfly]

sorry, this is a pet peeve of mine...Goat legs should not look like a guy on tippy toe!

http://www.uo.com/uoml/images/creatures/satyr_th.jpg

[nacire]

What if they are canine type legs? I'll admit the concept looks more goatlike, while your mesh is looking more werwolf like. What are you shooting for here Indianboy?

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c18/ajtzhu/Werewolf3.gif

Hey Indianboy, I really have to agree with Gauss here and can't help but think you missed something really sweet by getting stuck to this design. As you said, In the future... Hehe.

Your base mesh looks pretty decent, but remember to keep your polygons spread out equally. You dont wan't any big gaps so that when you subdivide one area becomes overly dense while another doesn't have enough geometry to support your sculpt. /images/graemlins/crazy.gif

http://img387.imageshack.us/img387/162/paintovergv1.jpg

[Mark Dygert]

Indian_Boy, I'm glad you started meshing around and moving forward, it already puts your concept to shame and will allow people to see what you see a lot easier. It will also keep the project moving forward and give people more to crit/comment on. It's coming along nicely, keep at it =)

[indian_boy]

[vig] puts it to shame in a good way, right? lol, thanks btw. and i was hoping that i could generate some more interest, c/c by putting a mesh up... that's mainly why i was in a rush...

[snowfly]the legs: i understand that the concept is showing goat legs, but later on (when i was making the mesh) i felt that goats = cute and fuzzy ; canines = friggin' scary. That's my point of view (though i _have_ been charged by a goat, lol). Also, with the wolf-legs, i figure i could add some details like tendons etc.

oh, and thanks [nacire] for the tips about polygon spreading-out. I'm not entirely sure how sculpting/subdividing work, but i'm interested in trying some mudboxing out for this mesh... so thanks for the warning. and yes... will be listening to Gauss' advice in the future...lol

now for the update:
http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/16f12938-03.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/16f12938-03/)http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/cd1eac96-face01.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/cd1eac96-face01/)
as u can see, it consists of 2 images... image number 1 is the usual 3-orthos + 2-perspectives that i post. and number 2 is a focus on the head (is it understandable?).
here's what i got so far:
1) base-mesh (syymetrical parts) is complete. now i will collapse stack, and do assymetrical stuff.
2) head is almost complete; need to make second set of canine teeth, and three suckers on the inside.

or so i believe......

once again... any c and c is awesome!

[Snowfly]

okay i see what you're going for, but its not that they don't look like wolf or goat legs per se. they just look like regularly proportioned human legs, calf muscles and all, with the feet stretched out. simply not believable at this point.. i think nacire and i posted some pretty good reference that you can extrapolate from? take your time to figure out the structure. i feel the legs are really hurting your model and you definitely don't want that.

also another suggestion is to either give the slouch a sharper bend, throw the shoulders forward, or don't model the slouch at all and take care of it in the posing stage instead.

good luck

http://techrepublic.com.com/i/tr/gallery/slouch.jpg

[indian_boy]

hmm... i think i'll keep him without the slouch until the posing stage...
as for the legs, i think i'll have to look at mop's last year's entry, cuz i think his entry's were similar?

as of now... this is my knowledge of wolf hindleg anatomy (i know that the lower-leg bone is not split into 2 like lower arm... i made a mistake in photoshop, and im too lazy to fix it /images/graemlins/smile.gif)
http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/cfd1cf54-Sliber.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/cfd1cf54-Sliber/)

i guess i need to meat up his ankle-toes section? any advice would be great, thanks.

[Sectaurs]

The problem is the overall proportions are that of someone crouched on his toes, so thats exactly what it looks like.

Take a look at nature's solution to the problem

unguligrades:
http://trc.ucdavis.edu/mjguinan/apc100/modules/Musculoskeletal/skeleton/images/biomech1.jpg

and

digitigrades:
http://trc.ucdavis.edu/mjguinan/apc100/modules/Musculoskeletal/skeleton/images/biomech2.jpg

both sport the 'extra' bend in their legs you'd want, and both have been well tested at supporting a variety of critters and weights.

[indian_boy]

okay, i see wat u mean there, i guess... i did this to the legs before i could come onlineand c the advice:
http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/061ab6cf-LEGS01.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/061ab6cf-LEGS01/)
its still wrong that means - nonetheless... how r the toes looking?

here's my plan then: shorten the thigh, lower the 'ankle' to kinda' flatten the ankle-to-toe bend... and elongate the actual foot? that should make it seem more correct?

thanks guys, further c and c is welcome /images/graemlins/smile.gif
---
edit:
do either of these seem more correct? i just modified the second pic that sectaurs gave me (thanks for them by the way...)
http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/59d89b01-Sliber.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/59d89b01-Sliber/)http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/e26ccbb3-Sliber.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/e26ccbb3-Sliber/)

i think the one on the left looks correct? should i go with something like that?
once again, thanks guys!

[Snowfly]

in both pictures sectaur posted, the metatarsal part of the foot is not vertical as in your model.

the digitigrade looks good to go for a biped. why don't you model over that instead?

the study on the left you did looks like it's getting there, stance-wise it is fine. just watch where you place the musculature, i.e. the knee should be covered in less flesh than the back of the knee. also watch where you place the center of balance. as a general rule, don't let the knee stick out further than the toes.

i sketched this out to illustrate some points yesterday, but my internet connection crapped out and i couldn't post it...the red lines are there to show how each bone hooks slightly.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v353/chrisdejoya/Untitled-1.jpg

[indian_boy]

hmm... i think i see what ur getting at... excuse my lack of anatomical knowledge and whatnot... but i guess something like these would be more correct:
http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/34be06a2-legs02.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/34be06a2-legs02/)
only thing i'm confused about is whether to do the one on the left or the right. I like the look of the left one, but is it okay structurally?

many thanks for the help... getting an understanding of wolf-legs now...

[Sectaurs]

Here's a quick paint-over I did to show you how I'd handle his legs.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v192/Sectaurs/Pimpage/digitigrade.jpg

[indian_boy]

first off, the head which i shoulda', coulda', woulda' posted yesterday... but forgot... so here it is, with both sets of teeth, jaws, but missing the sucker-mouths:
http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/e3164044-face02.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/e3164044-face02/)
[one jaw is open only]

now, onto more pressing matters:
nice paintover... thanks alot for it... i kinda' did that in max, and in that case, should i be saying: et voila?

here it is....
http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/92b5dab5-legs03.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/92b5dab5-legs03/)
thanks again for all u help... lookin' forward to more /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[indian_boy]

i won't call this a bump, cuz i have honest questions /images/graemlins/smile.gif:

how should i go about making the high res character. Should i make the assymetrical base in max, move into mudbox, high-res him, bring him back and then conform the low-res to high-res...?
also, my comp can hardly handle a million polies... any way to optimize desktop/win xp to churn out more from the comp? (i neeed un upgrade)
and finally: can bodypaint see the effect of a normal map on a model as i paint the diffuse on it? how can i use the normal map as a ref for painting the diffuse?

thanks guys...
i might not get an update in today... got a cricket match to watch and a maths final to study for /images/graemlins/smile.gif!

[indian_boy]

hey, i managed to get an hour with the model! this is all i did:
http://img75.imageshack.us/img75/923/04jy1.th.jpg (http://img75.imageshack.us/my.php?image=04jy1.jpg)
not much really... reworked the feet a bit, began the shoulder pads (they're symmetrical now... not for long) and changed the head about a bit...
as soon as i get a confirm that the legs are looking fine, that symmetry modifier is gonna get collapsed!

any and all crits and comments are welcome

[indian_boy]

okay, update time:
http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/9334/05xw5.th.jpg (http://img222.imageshack.us/my.php?image=05xw5.jpg)
symmetry is still on, the shoulderpads and retractable blades are seperate objects i'll attach later...
and now, for my first ever mudboxed piece... after hours and hours of struggling... i give you.... his first set of teeth:
http://img149.imageshack.us/img149/6762/teethqh0.th.jpg (http://img149.imageshack.us/my.php?image=teethqh0.jpg)
how do they look?

okay, seriously though... any comments and crits are good. I'm guessnig the legs r fine now, so i'm leaving them alone for the time being... gonna work on shoulder-pads and blade.
BTW: im approaching 4000 tris already... is that bad? i think there are some polies i should look to delete.

thanks guys, once again _any_ comments are good!

[Sectaurs]

dude, i think you've gotten enough crits so that you need not complain if half a day goes by without any /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

his legs are looking much better... more believable now.

for his chompers... needs to be much sharper, right now it suffers from mudboxitis: far too blobby for its own good.

[indian_boy]

ur right sectaurs... i do have some "problems" and need to brought back to 'normal' sometimes (ie. gauss about the bumps.) so i apologize...

anyways:
glad that the legs are looking better. i guess i can consider that hurdle crossed?
now his teeth... mudboxitis eh? I guess i could do something (alot-things) to fix that. But as of now, i present both sets of teeth, "complete"!
http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/8783/teeth02gg9.th.jpg (http://img171.imageshack.us/my.php?image=teeth02gg9.jpg)
the first set (like the ones above) are used for crushing and grinding bones and marrow into powder. i guess they need to look more like molars?
the second set (the pointy ones) are canines for ripping out meat and what not...
hope u like 'em!

[indian_boy]

alrighty... decided to send the blade into mudbox to high-res it. and this is what i came up with.
http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/7726/retractableblade01et5.th.jpg (http://img521.imageshack.us/my.php?image=retractableblade01et5.jpg)
i dunno if it's clear or not, but its supposed to be a weird animal skull that he's embedded into his arm. I'm thinking of making the rest look like a spinal column and the part that attaches to his arms look like ribs or more teeth (teeth in the stomach of the beast?)

its not done yet (need to add nose hole and eye sockets for example) but even still..... any thoughts?
thanks.

[indian_boy]

update:
http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/6623/retractableblade02en5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
front and back/bottom of the thing. didn't overlay a colour this time though...
and here are two shots to show how the high-poly fits onto the low-poly body... im a bit worried about the wrist area as there is a curve to the side over there... don't think it'll cause a problem during riggin/posing though?
http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/1323/44062772pp0.jpg (http://imageshack.us)http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/7690/55190508sz6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[indian_boy]

i guess the blade isn't much of an attention grabber... i need to rad-ify it... but for now, here it is:
http://img187.imageshack.us/img187/3383/retractableblade03ho3.th.jpg (http://img187.imageshack.us/my.php?image=retractableblade03ho3.jpg)
the crappy colouring is just to show that some bumpy parts are actually under the skin /images/graemlins/smile.gif...
and now im beginning to think that i'm spending too much time on this thing... must move back to the main mesh!!!
any comments, crits, complaints, insults, are completely welcome /images/graemlins/smile.gif.

[spacemonkey]

indian_boy if the arm/skull imbeded things is a big selling point for this guy then you really need to push it further - ie make it larger, make the spine intergration chunkier and more noticable. Its a good start for the character but you might find it better if you work on the whole thing (as in all area's of the character) rough out what you want and then go back and detail more. Focusing on this one area might seem important now but it might get lost on the guy later as you create other larger interesting area's. /images/graemlins/smile.gif WHO know's, just keep going!

[Cridder]

I agree with <font color="green">spacemonkey</font> work the hole model and work the base of it up and then focus on higher details like blade arm. Get all your mucel and bone definision of your character done first.

Keep up the hard work and lest see a well rounded model.

[indian_boy]

okay so i took your advice, and brought the whole mesh into mudbox. After sculpting the mesh as a whole at 4 levels, my comp started lagging at 5th level, so i had to mask areas etc. etc. In doin so, i'm practically focussing on major chunks separately (i don't think it should be too prablematic this way.) As of now, i've got the head to a minimal-presentable level. Now i'll jump ahead to other chunks to bring them up to the same level of detail one by one, and then repeat the cycle /images/graemlins/smile.gif!
http://img154.imageshack.us/img154/3620/face03xn4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
here's the head, with the suckermouths (which also have teeth by the way).

[Dread_Reaper]

Those wings look like Kerrigan.

As for the composition, I think you'd be better off going in a single direction. The smooth contours of the battle suit seem to contrast the roughness of the wings and tail. You might find better reactions if you stick with a certain basic concept and continue with it.

-Dread_Reaper

[indian_boy]

im not sure i understand exactly what u mean dread_reaper...
a) the wings weren't my concept
b) the 'battle-suit' u refer to is his boey armour i suppose? in which case, the contrast between the two (in colour aswell as shape) was something i _wanted_... is that a bad thing?

----
UPDATE:
alright, did the torso a bit.... the model has reached 2 mill polies, and the lag is killing me! im glad masking in mudbox works like it does!!!
http://img137.imageshack.us/img137/3273/hipolyfication01gj7.jpg
tell me what u guys think....
thanks in advance =)

[Dread_Reaper]

Sorry Indian Boy, I accidently replied to the wrong post. My apologies.

-Dread_Reaper

[spacemonkey]

ok, what you need to do is drop your model down to the lowest subdivisions... and starting working in those.. do most of the work in the lower subdivisions and you will have a solid base to detail later

[indian_boy]

its okay dread_reaper... i just got a bit confused thats all

and spacemonkey... hmm, okay please don't take this as a dismissal of ur advice, but isn't it also possible to do this:
1)low poly "sketch" in max
2) make 'sketch' hi-res [with _all_ details]using mudbox/zbrush...
3) import highres model into max
4) conform the low poly to the high poly (while adding cuts and whatnot). this would become the final low-poly model.
5)UV mapping and tex baking etc. etc.

im new to normal mapping (at the scale of a whole character at least) so i'm just wondering if this is also good?
plus, to work at the lowest sub-d i would have to work im max right? to add the new cuts etc (is it possible in mudbox?)

thanks

[Cridder]

What I believe what spacemonkey was trying to suggest was to work with a lower rez model in mudbox/zbrush. Currently your model is probably in the millions right? I know in zbrush you import your low rez obj and are able to divide your model to your computers ability. So say you divided your model 5x your base model. What spacemonkey is suggesting is to work on the lower rezes, so 2x or 3x. They will be higher rez then your max model but lower rez then your current state.

[Sectaurs]

Cridder nailed it.

You need to bring out the forms in the lower subdivisions before you crack it up and start working on the micro-detailing. This will get rid of the meshsmoothed-with-fiddly-bits-on-top look its currently suffering from.

[rooster]

yeah that or just use big brushes if your pc handles it, either way get some medium size detail. Detail isn't just small stuff..

[indian_boy]

oh okay... thanks for clearing that up. i thought 'lowest' subdivision meant _lowest_ (in which case it would be uber-hard to get any detail i think?)
so i decided to go into the 5000s-10,000 polies and add details like muscle definition (eg. biceps), knee caps, elbows, underside of the hand etc. these would count as medium res right? and then i'll go up the lvls and high-res it while giving tighter defs to the muscles etc....
so i think i got it?
thanks guys...

----
okay, i was gonna update the post, but im having problems with imageshack and slibe using opera and internet explorer... so i'll post an update later.
once again, thanks! /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[indian_boy]

and ta-daaaa!
http://img139.imageshack.us/img139/5355/hipolyfication02st4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
2 shots... one is subdiv X2 and one is subdiv X3 (or 4, can't remember). Just to show what type of 'construction' is going on.
any c'n'c is cool... it all helps!

thanks!

[Xaltar]

You go boy, good to see such a huge improvement in your work since you first showed up here. Keep at it 8)

[rooster]

yeah coming on nicely man, but it feels like you're being a little timid with your sculpting, just a little here and a little there. Don't forget you've got layers to make the most of, really go at it and put some shape into him. If you use a seperate layer you can always pull it back a bit if you need to

[Cridder]

Looking better but you should really push the muscel and bone definitions. He is fairly human so get some pictures of the human muscel structure to use as referance. More definition the better cause you can always build from them. Think of your base Max model as a skeloten of your character, then think of the first couple suddiv's as muscel and bone definition and the higher subdivs as skin, wrinkles and other fine definitions.

You'll also want to work on the wings and tail to make sure they look like they are appart of the model and not just stuck on.

Keep up the hard work /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[indian_boy]

hey thanks for the confidence boost guys.... glad that there's been noticable improvements since my earlier work...

@ Rooster - layers ftw! i never even noticed (i kinda just got mudbox and didn't have time to mess wit it before the competition!)
@ Cridder - thanks for the analogy... good help... and good point about the 'wings' + tail... i'll have to devote some time to them, soon...
---
Update:
alright, i _had_ gone a bit crazy wit the sculpting (timidity begone!) but then i realized that i should probably define his structure properly first (like bone/muscle definitions). So i deleted the layer (oooh layers!) and got to work on the definitions. I don't know if there have been any striking changes, but... ummm... there have been changes.
So, tell me what u think!
http://img216.imageshack.us/img216/15/hipolyfication03qa0.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
i'm having trouble with the legs in terms of adding mid-res details (dunno what to add). Also, i'm trying to not make him _too_ muscular.

any crits and comments are welcome!
thanks again!

[Cridder]

I did a sketch over one of your older models showing generic muscel structure. You will probly notice, like did when drawing it, that your character dont have an ass. I personaly find it hard to create leg muscelature with one of the largest muscels gone. Now I know the muscel stucture I drew makes your guy bigger but I was trying to exagerate were the muscels would be visible.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y226/Cridder/indian_boyStucture.jpg

The second thing I noticed is that your guyz centre of gravity is off (the red line indicates were his COG is}. If he is to stand in that current pose in real life he would find himself falling backwards. You need to pull his legs and head back alittle to re-centre his gravity.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y226/Cridder/indian_boyCOG.gif

Righting the COG will help when you rigg him to put him into pose, other wise I have had troubles in the past when creating a rigg were the legs were giving me trouble when I tried moving them.

Keep up the hard work /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[indian_boy]

thanks, cridder, for the two images. I'm tryin to implement the muscle structure u've drawn without bulkying up the character too much, and i think its coming along okay. as for the COG, i think i'll fix that after i've baked the normal map... on the low poly mesh, shouldn't be too much trouble to do it then either?

in general, i really need to hurry up cuz:
1) i have final exams starting this friday, and my pace will slow (possibly :P)
2) i'm slow at the texturing and riggin parts, 2 things which i'm feeling really nervous about...
so i wanna wrap up the high res asap.... unfortunately....
----
UPDATE:
http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/2729/hipolyfication04ln6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
i've been working on levels 2 and 3... but i took these shots on the highest level (lvl.5) i'm being really careful not to overdo the muscular struture.

[Sectaurs]

well, its coming along, but its like pulling teeth /images/graemlins/smile.gif

you've been great about implementing all the sweet pro-tips except for the big one... alter that silhouette! When they say go crazy, they don't just mean add some muscles in the existing streamlined meshsmoothed form. We want to see massive globs of flesh pulled and pushed. At this point I'd love to see you go way too far and have to dial it back than what you've been doing. You'll get there, I've no doubt, but as this is a timed affair we're going to be behind you pushing you to the finish line. whether you like it or not! /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[indian_boy]

massive globs of flesh: arise!
well not yet, just a small flesh-glob now. i have to study /images/graemlins/frown.gif....
http://img179.imageshack.us/img179/3833/hipolyfication05bs1.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
here's the update. Just added an extension of the pelvis at the back, modified his "exo-rib" a bit and added a magnet on his back where the gun gets "holstered".

will go ahead with going crazy this afternoon

[indian_boy]

okay, i wont really call this much of an update, but thought id put it on nonetheless.... i feel kinda' strange whenever i work on this guy nowadays. And not the giggly hee hee strange... like a creative-block after a halfhours work. Kinda' annoying really!

well, anyways, here's the update:
http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/3906/hipolyfication06jt7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[gauss]

go back and read all of spacemonkey's posts in your thread again, as well as rooster's on this page. your model is improving, yes, but it's also suffering in exactly the manner that spacemonkey and rooster are telling you. i shall attempt to use my incredible powers of description in order to let you see your error, since i cannot show you visually! /images/graemlins/laugh.gif
art and composition is all about starting with the general and working toward the specific. you lock in the big stuff before you lock in the small stuff. if you were building a house, would you start with digging the foundation, or would you start doing 3cm detail work on the brass hand railing out front?
that seems an absurd comparison, but that's what you've been doing with your high poly sculpt of this model. you should be figuring out the house's overall dimensions still, but you're over with an interior decorator picking out curtains.

look at your latest screenshot and squint your eyes, so that you can just barely see it. what do you see? you can see the silhouette, but not a whole lot more than that.
now go over to spacemonkey's thread (or a dozen other good artists' threads) and repeat the same trick: notice how with strong shapes, they pass the squint test that much better than yours? how spacemonkey's tentacle monster is still pretty recognizable, even when you can barely see it?

so like they keep telling you, you need to resolve bigger areas of detail before you start on the smallest ones.

you honestly can't study the good stuff too much in order to learn what you're doing wrong, frankly. in fact, learning to see, to sensitize yourself to the nuances of drawing, of sculpting, of color and texture and on and on are the only way you'll improve as an artist.

you know how to women in general--moms and sisters and girlfriends, some things always look the same? guns are all the same. jet fighters all look pretty much the same; all those things boys are interested in tend to look the same to them. they couldn't tell you the difference between a Glock 18 and a 1911 or a 5-7 pistol to save their lives, because they just don't care. they haven't sensitized to those details.
but of course, we're all like that in the areas that are outside our expertise. just like most women can't 'see' guns, you probably can't 'see' women's clothing anywhere like how they can. (if you can, well, then it's probably time to have a different kind of talk with your parents.)
and it's exactly that kind of process that you need to go through in order to become a better artist--you need to be exposed to good examples of what it is you're trying to learn about, and you need to pay attention to all the details that you never did before. learning technical terms or specific names of things (especially in the case of anatomy) will often help you out in these areas. specialized lingo is a very good way of sensitizing to a whole world of naunce that you previously were oblivious too--and sensitivity to shapes, colors, proportions, surfaces, textures, and what have you, is what being an artist is all about.


so apart from the lecture about sensitizing yourself, go back and re-read my post again a couple of times. i know, i know, it's a lot of wisdom to absorb, so you'll need to read it a few times. /images/graemlins/laugh.gif so take time to really LOOK at the entries you know are well-put together sculpts, and then compare them directly to your own model. it may be discouraging and sort of obvious, but do it and be specific about calling out all the different ways that your model isn't like them. contrary to what some people will tell you, just working and working doesn't guarantee that you'll learn shit. you have to be aware, and keep growing that awareness, in order to internalize the necessary lessons.

in other words... dammit kid, mind your elders! /images/graemlins/laugh.gif

[indian_boy]

it seems unfortunate that such a long, detailed piece of advice can only be responded to by the following words:
I see what you're getting at! /images/graemlins/smile.gif

Thanks for the crit, though... i get what u mean by the squint test... interesting idea that. And i guess i'll have to go crazy with the sculpting (as has been suggested before, but i guess im 'afraid' ?!) once again, thanks for the advice.

-----
UPDATE:
http://img300.imageshack.us/img300/4936/hipolyfication07vw7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
can u see a change? cuz i can't... lol!
okay, i just modified his 'wings' before responsibility struck me and i realized i should study for friday...

tell me what u guys think. any comments and crits are welcome. They don't all have to be as in-depth as the "Gaussian" ones /images/graemlins/crazy.gif.

I'm off to study the Rise of Indian Nationalism... (studying Gandhi during wartime?!!!)

thanks in advance!

[gauss]

watch it with the "gauss-ian blur vision," smartass /images/graemlins/smile.gif

you may not have changed much, but it's actually very much more a step in the right direction. compare how much you've modified the wing geometry between this update and the previous update--we simply want to see that degree of large-scale form sculpting/manipulation on the rest of the model. and just as when you're sketching, don't get timid just because you want to preserve work you've already done (like all the teeny weeny detailing on the torso and such). this is digital art, there's no possible way you can "ruin" it--so just save out an instance and then go nuts. if you need to revert, you can, but this isn't a priceless block of marble, it's digital clay that you can re-attempt sculpture of endlessly. be bold! don't worry, we'll tell you if you need to scale it back /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[rooster]

you don't even need to save an instance, just make a new layer and if you do something you don't like you can erase the area and the original shines through.. theres no excuse to be timid /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[indian_boy]

wow its been some time since i posted.... well, im missing this mornings post at least.

uhh, okay, im glad that the radical change has brought some positive feedback (sorry bout the gauss-ian blur vision... spur of the moment /images/graemlins/smile.gif)

now then, this post comes after only 25 minutes of work (can't get my mind off the exams) so its not _as_ substantial, but its an attempt at breaking / changing the silhouette in some other places.

http://img172.imageshack.us/img172/7168/hipolyfication08rg5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
(note the lack of the gauss-ian blur vision... oh noes...! im srry, im doin it again......)

thanks for the crits rooster and gauss, they're extremely helpful, so please do keep 'em coming.
and to the others... please do rip me apart!

August 15 1947 approaches.........
oh and armageddon begins tomorrow

[Joao Sapiro]

you should try to sculpt in lower res first before going up res , that way you wont define much shape and it ill have that muddy look your model has.

[indian_boy]

im not sure i understand ur suggestion johny... if i do low res first, i _will_ or will _not_ have the muddy look?

sorry, but no updates today, i feel pooped after the exam today... so i guess ill wait till tomorrow.

till then though, any crits and comments are welcome...

[Xaltar]

He means you should do your larger sculpts at a lower subdivision level and then work the small details into the higher sub levels /images/graemlins/wink.gif

I'll be having my first go at sculpting in a short while too so reading your thread is going to be useful to me too /images/graemlins/wink.gif

Keep at it dude, I am really impressed at how far you have come.

[indian_boy]

@Xaltar -i understood that bit... i was confused about the "muddy look"....
good luck with ur sculpting! and thanks!

okay, feeling fairly uninspired at the moment for the body. No radical ideas are coming to me, so i decided on starting the model for the gun. This is the high poly, its not done yet though. Just wanted to get some comments on it...
http://img167.imageshack.us/img167/9666/gun01az5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

any crits and comments are welcome!

[indian_boy]

maybe not enough work done on the gun to have it commented on i guess...
but any thoughts at all are good!
here's an update on the gun model. I think its coming along fairly nicely, just need some good crits to fix up problems i might not be seeing.
http://img71.imageshack.us/img71/4508/gun02op2.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

once again, any comments are welcome
thanks in advance...

[Xaltar]

Looking good so far, keep it up /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[Joao Sapiro]

that in my opinion is a fake highpoly , if you throw down a urbosmooth or meshmooth, all that would smooth horribly . id advise to lern some hard edge modeling before attempting a model that comples /images/graemlins/wink.gif

also about the muddy look , is something when people look at your model, and can see loas of blits and blobs that simply look out of place to fake "realism" .

good luck with this man, its good to see your dedication /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[Cridder]

I dont quite get the reason why there is an open door on the "CPU Fan" on the gun. I think you should either see the fan or the pannel, its a waist of detail that will not be seen unless the gun was animated and parts were to be taken off it.

Other wise the gun looks like it is comming along, hope you get it finished soon you you can finish your character. Keep the hard work /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[rooster]

I'm concerned with how well this will normal map (the gun) It looks like you have a lot of 90 degree angles, which won't be picked up well and itll end up looking flat. I'd do a quick test normal map to see how it comes out

[indian_boy]

@ Xaltar - thanks for the confidence!

@ Johny - thanks for clearing that up. i understand now. and u were right about the turbosmooth thing. lol, trust me you were dead right!

@ Cridder - i agree that it _is_ a waste of detail. But i was thinking that (even though we don't make anims for the compo) i might make some practice anims with this guy in the future, so i might wanna 'coolify' some mechanical parts on the gun. Or should i cancel that idea and use them polies to help change the silhouette? oh and thanks for the support!

@ Rooster - ill do that right away! i don't want a problematic normal map close to deadline... but i figured that the 90 degree angles ur talking about are where the outer edges of the gun meet? well, i had chamfered those for a smoother look, will it read okay this way? even still, i should do a test map.

=====
UPDATE:
okay, this time around, i've only chamfered and cleaned up the gun alot. I've applied a turbo-smooth to many of the portions (yes its many different meshes). The other parts still need too much cleaning up to display wit a turbosmooth.

http://img339.imageshack.us/img339/6728/gun03ag2.th.jpg (http://img339.imageshack.us/my.php?image=gun03ag2.jpg)
[im going back to using thumbnails... even my net was slowing down by the end of the last page]

I'll be rendering a quick normal map just to test it (don't really need to do a perfect UV Template for a test do i?) and see what else i need to fix up.

thanks for all the help guys...

[indian_boy]

okay, unhappy that i haven't been able to post an image update today... maybe tomorrow. But thought i'd at least keep all notified of what i've done today.
The test normal map was coming out crappy (the thing i've got going in the front wasn't reading at all) so i modified the low poly silhouette a bit, and i lessened the angles on all that stuff. (i guess anything less than 90 degrees reads well?)

also, i scrapped the panel idea, it was eating too many polies, and i decided to change the silhouette instead. I'm extremely close to the limit of 1000, and the only other 'accessories' would be the ammo pieces. so it should all fit in.

I've also modified the back section of the gun (added a few details), and am scrapping my idea of giving it a trigger (my other idea was the whole "thought-controlled" thing).

i'd say that my gun is "done." i'll show it tomorrow to see if there are any easy modifications or glaring problems with it. The thing is that i wanted at least 10 days for texturing + rigging... so thats until this friday for finishing the high-polies. :gulp:

once again, thanks for all the help

[indian_boy]

right here's the update:
http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/3127/gun041vi8.th.jpg (http://img223.imageshack.us/my.php?image=gun041vi8.jpg)http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/7113/gun042th0.th.jpg (http://img223.imageshack.us/my.php?image=gun042th0.jpg)
i (for some reason) lost a bit of detailing work i did late last night.... i might make that again, it wasn't much though....
tell me wat u guys think please!

[Cridder]

The gunz grip (handle) looks like it would brake off it off if held one handed. I suggest making it bigger and more sturdy looking, also if this is realyy a large gun then I suggest having another place that the other hand can hold/rest.

Looks pretty good though /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[indian_boy]

hmmm i guess ill make it more sturdy then. as for the other hand, i thought it could grip the side 'railing' or something. thanks.

===

okay no update yet, but :
i just came back from a potentially high-scoring maths final exam, and have 8 days to "study" for english. So, today i will be working for hours on end, and the crits i could get in "right now" would be extremely helpful. Hopefully i can get alot done starting after lunch. That gives me ~ 30 mins... when i'll come back and c if there r new crits, and ill implement them.

Wish me luck... i want my eyes to burn out by the end of today!!

[indian_boy]

lol, what r the chances. i had a 5 hour marathon planned yesterday, and :
1) a one-hour powercut slows me down
2 my LAN provider craps out. Well, at least the nets working now.

====
alright, yesterday, i got some sculpting done, not much, so i won't show it yet. What i _did_ complete however, was the UV template for the gun + accessories and projecting their normal maps.
It gives me some confidence now that i've projected my first normal map for this compo... makes me feel like i can do it.

http://img83.imageshack.us/img83/4198/accessoriesnormalsmapfw7.th.jpg (http://img83.imageshack.us/my.php?image=accessoriesnormalsmapfw7.jpg)
normals need some repair work. Im guessing i could simply paint over the ugly-green parts? But how is the template? I'm not too good at figuring out what should be how big... now: back to sculpting! or possibly repairing the normals map...

oh, and thanks in advance!

[indian_boy]

Exhibit A:
Gun with some diffuse work
http://img213.imageshack.us/img213/473/gun05xq0.th.jpg (http://img213.imageshack.us/my.php?image=gun05xq0.jpg)
any suggestions about colour scheme etc. r welcome... i had tried the browns, but they didnt look cool... so decided to go with greys instead. Oh, and the grip [or a part of it] is gonna be wrapped in leather.

Exhibit B:
http://img213.imageshack.us/img213/1167/hipolyfication09wb5.th.jpg (http://img213.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hipolyfication09wb5.jpg)
I'm completely out of ideas as of what to do with sculpting. I added so little, i actually feel like i went back a few steps!!! i don't wanna call it though {ie. i dont wanna leave the sculpt like this, i want to improve it}. any suggestions?

alright guys, thats the last update for the day...
any suggestions about any aspect (particularly the ones i'd asked for above) would be great.

thanks.

[rollin]

if you want to improve the sclupting reduce the blobby-muddiness on certain areas
and if you want to add some stuff than look at some realy good sculptings (there are some entrys in this comp) and try to get what they do other than you:

they have more sharp edges, they are more sculpting than rather painting some 3d onto the surface and they exaggerate the main structures bc through normalmapping you always loose some depth

keep pushing until your pc says "no" /images/graemlins/wink.gif

so on keep on /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[indian_boy]

thanks for the suggestion rollin, from what i understand (correct me if im wrong) i have to "add" and "subtract" right next to each other in more places so i get a tighter, sharper edge in those places.

[indian_boy]

well, thats what i've been doing for the last half-hour as well as adding some new stuff (very little). And after using "gauss-ian blur vision" on it, i noticed that i could pick up (see) the sharper edges even wit a 4 px blur.... is that wat the "squint-test" is all about?
well, here it is... any further suggestion or advice is welcome:
http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/62d0dd18-Sliber.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/62d0dd18-Sliber/)

once agani, all crits and comments are welcome

[indian_boy]

waning interests? well i guess i haven't done much really....

well anyways, trudging along at a real slow pace, something im not comfortable about at all). I just have no idea what to do..... and just a week left! argh!

http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/fd975fe4-Sliber.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/fd975fe4-Sliber/)
any ideas would be helpful.
thanks guys.

[Cridder]

Well here's a morel boost. Your model has come along way with everyone giving their imput your skills as far as I can tell have improved greatly. You finally have harder less muddy surface comming through. The only parts I suggest spending more time on is the back, lower torso, and the feet. Give them more definition and structure so that they match the amount of detail compaired to the rest of the body. It is good to have less detailed areas on the body but only when it its balanced.

Kick your ass into gear for no more then two more days of modeling and then spend the rest of your time texturing cause a texture and either make the model mind blowing, save it or destroy it.

You can do it /images/graemlins/smile.gif Keep up the hard work.

[indian_boy]

thanks cridder. moral boosts are what i need.... and i'll do some stuff with the chest/feet area..... the reason that the back is bear is that it'll be covered by the gun at any rate, so didn't see any reason to use up time on it.

No update for now... i just woke up... but i've decided that today will be my last sculpting day, cuz as cridder rightfully said: a texture can make / break or save a model.

One question i had, however:
I had imported my low poly at 4k tris into mudbox. Now with all the new bits etc. i'll obviously crank up the tri count on my model. Problem is that, yesterday, when i tried to import the highpoly, Max crashed on me all 3 tries. SO, my question is that: after i modify my low poly and conform it to (say level 3 /4 instead of 5 of) my highpoly, can i send out the new lowpoly (wit UV template) to mudbox and project a normal map? Cuz sometimes when i try to import, it says "vertice numbers must match" or something.

please help me...

and once again, thanks.
Update to come in a few hours.

[Xaltar]

What I did was export a lower sub version of my highpoly (one that didn't crash max) and conformed my low poly to that, then, once I had it all lined up properly I used the bake tool in mudbox to bake my normals. It's not perfect but for those of us with older PCs it seems to be the only option /images/graemlins/frown.gif

Bare in mind I had my uv's set up before I even put the lowpoly into mudbox. As a result I have a bit of streaching but nothing noticeable..

[indian_boy]

thanks xaltar. will try that. Hopefully it won't say something like "not enough memory to load high poly mesh" or something....

===
well, okay, this update is a bit earlier than i expected. I suppose i'll be calling the highpoly done [even though i kinda don't want to]? cuz i want time with the textures (im slow at painting).
http://img441.imageshack.us/img441/551/hipolyfication12gs2.th.jpg (http://img441.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hipolyfication12gs2.jpg)
i've added a belt across his chest on which 2 ammo thingies will be attached by magnet. I suppose it would look fairly good.
Also, i wanted to show what i did to the feet. Added a bone piece to protect his 'achilles tendon' cuz i wanted to maintain a smooth surface over there, while still adding some detail.

any thoughts or suggestions? don't hesitate to post!
thanks again guys!

[indian_boy]

Right well, since nobody yelled out "r u insane that looks like a crappy high-poly, u should do :this-and-this:", i've begun unwrapping my model. Given the extension, im feelin a little more calm about my pace... cuz that means ill be able to made a good texture.

as of now, i have no update, just some questions:

1) any general advice on making textures? (wait, that's not a question : Could you give me some general advice on making textures?)
2) should i still be paniting in shadows in my diffuse tex? despite the normal map i mean
3) any tips on rendering out a height map using mudbox? i want to use it as a "multiply" later on top of my spec map.
4) are there alternatives to painting a spec map?
5) i've already asked what a dirt map is. So now i'm wondering: how do i make a good dirtmap?
6) Could u please explain how the Mudbox "Output texture" thing works? I get stretching and problems that i don't get when using 'projection' in max on lower sub-d levels of the mesh.

Thanks guys. I'll see if i can get an update by tonight. I might only get my UV Template done...

[rollin]

1) search the net

2) you can .. but realy "shadow-parts" are very tiny (in my case) and mostly i only black-out the very-dark-parts in my spec-map

3) don´t know .. but i would say... you don´t need it in your spec map /images/graemlins/wink.gif

4) alternatives to what? its so easy.. i make the diffuse and spec map in ones .. painting stuff on the diffuse, copying it to the spec (just a folder in my diffuse-working file) adjust it to fit the needed brightness and color and than go on

5)only dirtmap i know is the one from dawn of war.... paint it on the diffuse

6) dont know it /images/graemlins/smile.gif

hope this helps a bit

[indian_boy]

thanks man! helps quite a bit (though i think there's a misunderstanding about the 'dirtmap'?)

okay, so yesterday was partially wasted cuz we were trying to save a cow that got tangled in wires etc. so i didn't really get done with the UVW template. Still working on stuff, so since i had no image updates, i thought i'd ask a few (okay one) more questions:
- how can i preview normal maps in Bodypaint 3d? i apply it as a bump map, but it reads like a simpe bump map, not normals map.

oh, and the above questions still stand. wanna get in as many points of view(s?) as i can.

[indian_boy]

okay... thanks.
anyways, still working on unwrapping the model (yes, i art slow), and i just got this weird problem. There is a face who's verts i can't select. I can select its edges, i can select its edges, but i can't select/weld its verts. Any solution to this? thanks... (no restarting max / the computer didn't help).

thanks guys...

[Cridder]

The polygon maybe inverted. Try selecting it from inside your mesh. If this is true then you should have some command to invert it, unfortuanly I dont know it cause I never used Max before only XSI but there should be one if that is your problem.

[indian_boy]

nope that didn't work out... well, ill just kinda turn the faces about a bit till i get it to look like the verts are overlapping... thankfully this problem is only at the inner thigh area and will hardly be noticed. thanks anyways.

okay, still unwrapping, think ill be done by today, or by tomorrow morning (in case ur wondering, i have only 2 hrs a day on the project [cuz of exams])... meanwhile, another question:
ambient occlusion map.. what is it? i know that it can be rendered with a 'skylight' and 'light tracer' during the 'bake to texture'... but where do i apply the AO map?... or does it go over the diffuse as a multiply or something? and what _exactly_ is its purpose? (in terms of real-time art models, not for movie quality models...).

thanks....
the unwrapping is a real pain...

oh, and does 'relax' help in reducing stretching? how about the Deep UV 'relax'?

thanks again!

[Cridder]

From my understanding an AO map acts as a cheep reaplacement for a Final Gathering pass when done right. This helps save on render time and makes it so that they can have a fake FG in games (Though not as good imo).

And when you make an AO map you apply it onto your diffuse texture in PhotoShop as an multiply layer over top your diffuse.

Hope that helps, good luck on your exams /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[indian_boy]

thanks for the explanation and the luck /images/graemlins/smile.gif.
---
2 litres of coca cola, a few hours of Rammstein's music, and 20 minutes of studying french as the normal map renders (using xNormal), and here's what i got:
http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/487b9b0d-Sliber.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/487b9b0d-Sliber/)
and then some rough colouring... just a few minutes to show the colour scheme:
http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/c17559ad-Sliber.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/c17559ad-Sliber/)


maintenant il faut que j'aille etudier le francais. Si j'etudais bien, je reussirais..... and i don't want that to become:
si j'avais etudie bien, j'aurai reussit.

[Cridder]

Well your normals seem to be working for you and the colour scheme doesn't look to bad. My only current suggestion is for the hand blade spend a polygon or two and make a vertiacl grid opposite of the current one. Then when you make a mask and texture and use it on both it will give more of a round glow illusion compaired to just one grid. You'll find this trick used in lots of lowpoly online games like WOW and EVE.

Je ne sais pas... Tu es francais bien. (Gahh... I haven't used my french for over 3 years. Yours is pretty good though, but your right if you study good and hard you should do well... if you remember it and dont fall asleep on your keyboard. :P)

[indian_boy]

hehe, lol, yeah it went pretty well....
well thanks for the suggestion, will definately implement it, given that i have some spare polies...

now then, no update today. just been blocking out some stuff.... nothing too impressive. so instead, i ask a question /images/graemlins/grin.gif:
any advice on texturing gums and other gooey fleshy bits? i really can't do it well at the moment, so its looking nasty.

Thanks.

oh, and now its science, so i won't be typing in a 'foreign language'... well... science in itself is foreign to me... and i dont understand it, so how can i speak it!

[indian_boy]

okay, well, update time:
[lit with one omni, and rendered with standard scanline]
http://www.slibe.com/imagestumb/e431189c-Sliber.jpg (http://www.slibe.com/image/e431189c-Sliber/)

nothing much, but still... wanted to put it up to get some crits. thanks to cridder (thank u cridder), i now know how to make blood (in theory, not practice) so i hope to get some nasty looking blood on his jaw and retractable blades' tusks.

Oh, and anybody now how to make ground look like its cracking up and revealing magma / lava underneath? i want to try something along those lines for his stand.

anyways... all crits and comments are welcome. go ahead and tear me apart!

[Xaltar]

Looking good. Heres a texturing tuto that is helping me a lot at the moment, figure we nonPros should stick together /images/graemlins/wink.gif

http://www.3dtutorials.sk/index.php?software=3&amp;tutorials=11&amp;id=30&amp;page=1

Come on dude, get this badboy done /images/graemlins/cool.gif

[Cridder]

You'll only be able to get some of the wet look through the diffuse, you will have to rely on your Spec and Reflection maps to get the hole feeling. I suggest looking for pictures on google for referance and try to paint from life.

Hope that helps /images/graemlins/smile.gif Xaltar's suggested site also has other useful tuts. You may want to take so time searching if you really get stuck, they may have something /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[indian_boy]

thanks for the link Xaltar. and yes, we must stick together/images/graemlins/grin.gif... hoping that this guy _does_ get done.

cridder - okay, so its clear taht i need diffuse and spec to give the wet look, but do i really need a reflection map? saliva wouldn't reflect too much afaik. as for reference hunting, did a bit of that to help me on my way (some nasty results came up for 'decaying teeth' that made me nearly lose my breakfast btw.)

UPDATE:

alright, bit more texturing done, added a spec map to this guy, and the inner mouth is moving closer to what i want it to look like. i've even prepared this guy's rig, and applied "skin" to it, so i'm gonna be ready to pose him immediately after tex is done.
http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/2781/coloured03qv5.th.jpg (http://img156.imageshack.us/my.php?image=coloured03qv5.jpg)
any crits are welcome, along with a few answers if poosible:D :
1) my viewport rendering is going uber-slow. It takes ages to rotate the camera etc. unless i have "wireframe only" on. Any suggestions to speed up viewport rendering?

hmm wait... only one question?

okay, once again, any and all crits are welcome. feel free to simply comment too...

[Joao Sapiro]

the normals are uber muddy and you have seams everywhere i would first tweak the normal map before even doing difuse /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[indian_boy]

the problem is that i don't have enough time to set aside that 'normals now, diffuse now, spec now' time table. Don't take it as a dissmissal of ur advice, just that right now im kinda' doing everything at the same time. Expect the seams to be invisible at the end. /images/graemlins/grin.gif hopefully...

as of now, did some bloodying up of the tex. His hands and mouth are Guilty Of CGChat-slaughter... /images/graemlins/smile.gif.
http://img261.imageshack.us/img261/5061/coloured04wp3.th.jpg (http://img261.imageshack.us/my.php?image=coloured04wp3.jpg)
lit using an orange and a white light. And yes, that's the gun on his back.
still have alot of work to do, im thinking of doing more on the gun as the first priority for tomorrow. Speaking of tomorrow, i'll be studying the rest of today for tomorrow! oh noes! me hates science!

[indian_boy]

Alright, here we go:
http://img339.imageshack.us/img339/9205/prefinal01zp5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
posed him just to test my rig. This might even end up being his victory or beauty pose with the words "Mission Accomplished" being projected by his hologram displayer.
Alright, what else... worked on the texture and a stand (clearly)which doesn't look too neat.

Overall, not a very good performance by me. i shoulda, woulda, coulda spent more time on it had it not been for the exams. But meh... at least i can say "at least i tried"

Any crits that can boost me on the last day (tomorrow) and might even give something nice to my composition is what i need. Absolutely anything. Other than that, any comments are welcome too. Even if u say: "eew! that sux butt" /images/graemlins/smile.gif
comment away! (please lol)

[Snowfly]

For some reason I'm beaming like a proud daddy just seeing your finished entry. *wipes tears* Are your exams over? Ready to move on to your next model?

[indian_boy]

ahh thanks Snowfly. Glad u liked it, glad ur proud /images/graemlins/smile.gif
exams aint over till the 28th, but i've got an idea for the next model... well, thread... it's a bit different really.....
thanks again!

UPDATE:
okay, i got 10 hours left. So im tensed. Here are two shots. One beauty, one winning.... but im not sure which is which.
http://img379.imageshack.us/img379/2248/prefinal02ec5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
i prefer the roar (the left one) for winning but i'll turn the blade off.... and the other for beauty. Any thoughts? I've got soo much more to do. Any suggestions in general for the whole texture and stuff? Please guys, im counting on some last minute crits to give me a focussed direction....

thanks in advance... as of know, lunch, and then,
9hours of work!

please help, thanks!

[fogmann]

Hey, I think you have over a day and a half left and not only few hours (that is, if nothing is stopping you to continue working on this). Deadline is Monday night at 11:59pm GMT -5, which means that is Tuesday morning for you!.
If you plan to go back to the textures, I would suggest adding some color variation to the skin, it looks like a solid color all the way through. If you need to quickly add some skin details, try this (http://fogmann.com/temp/psbrushespack.rar) textured brushes pack, there are some skin and animal fur brushes that you can use to add skin detail very quickly. Also, I'm not seeing the specular, if you have it in there, maybe make it a bit brighter and up the contrast?
I like the roar pose for the winning shot, Yeah! And some glow on the green bits, you can't miss that /images/graemlins/laugh.gif

[Xaltar]

looking good dude. I like the howling pose, nice stuff /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[indian_boy]

@fogmann : yeah u've got a point there... the only problem is that i gotta study for the last of my exams... which is on the 28th... gotta give meself some time to study! /images/graemlins/laugh.gif But i will be keeping at it till into the night tonight... will definately do more to the textures... so thanks for the brush sets /images/graemlins/smile.gif
@Xaltar - thanks for the vote of confidence man!

Alright, so it seems that the roar is the more proper winning pose? as of now, here's what i got:
http://img340.imageshack.us/img340/9841/winningtest01wp2.jpg (http://imageshack.us)http://img340.imageshack.us/img340/2891/beautytest01qz3.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
higher contrasts on the spec lvl map, and i also added a light that affects 'specuar only'. Also, i fixed up some errors that were no the last shots. Will be submitting it tonight, so i have my "template" ready as u can see, with the black bar at the bottom. And the "beauty pose" is the idea i was aiming for... tell me what u guys think.

PS: the sizes are 800x900, but i'm gonna havta reduce the quality cuz its at 400k right now.
PPS: do we _have_ to include the high res model in the construction shot? or is it only the normals map on the tex sheet that's compulsary?

once again, all suggestions / comments / crits are welcome!

[indian_boy]

oh my! wats this?! Im done???
okay, honestly, i've submitted in all the final stuff. Reason being simple: it's about time! /images/graemlins/grin.gif I woulda loved to have more time to work on it... and i probably will work on it later on. I guess i'm kinda loosing steam on this project right now. All the excitement i had started with slowly eroded away... I may not (most definately will not) win anything... but i was never in it to win. I just wanted to particiapte... get my name 'out there,'... 'k, so without further a doo-doo:

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Winning Pose
http://www.gameartisans.org/contests/events/uploaded_images/32-game-3d-art-153-1174848357-winning.jpg
Beauty Shot
http://www.gameartisans.org/contests/events/uploaded_images/32-game-3d-art-153-1174848626-beauty.jpg
Texture Sheet
http://www.gameartisans.org/contests/events/uploaded_images/32-game-3d-art-153-1174886767-texSheets.jpg
Construction
http://www.gameartisans.org/contests/events/uploaded_images/32-game-3d-art-153-1174848712-construction.jpg
Concept
http://www.gameartisans.org/contests/events/uploaded_images/32-game-3d-art-153-1174887182-conceptcopy.jpg
entry notes:
NAME: Kanchchh Igliks
SPECIALITY: Infiltration and Assassination
EQUIPMENT: Day-vision / thermal vision Goggles, Retractable plasma blade, Holographic projector, Hydrogen Ion Thruster (HIT) Gun.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

tadaaaa!

now, a sincere thanks to everybody who helped, with paragraph long constructive crits, or two sentence confidence boosts.... i'll thank you equally... just to show how serious i am:
Thank you -
CaseyJones; Gauss; Gavku; Shady-D; Oglemeanimations; Dave_Hingley; Vig; Cridder; Dread_Reaper; Spacemonkey; Sectaurs; Rooster; Johny; Rollin; Snowfly; Fogmann; Nacire
.... i think thats all of u? this was off the top of my head

once again, any names i forgot; im sorry (nets going slow so i can't sift through all the pages)... but THANK YOU ALL!
I've learned alot about what i wanted to in this contest. Now i know what i do wrong (everything) and what i do right (dustball floats across the screen). My next post will be up and running soon... hope to see u guys there!

[rollin]

nice to see you finishing this /images/graemlins/smile.gif

yes you need a concept.. bc you can´t submit your entry if you don´t upload a concept.. you need all 5 pics

[Cridder]

Good to see that you have pulled through indian_boy, and thanks for the kind words /images/graemlins/smile.gif

Like rollin said, you need all 5 pics to submitt your entry. That inclues your concept sheet and texture flats. If you don't know what I am talking about check my last post out on my thred.

Good luck on your final exams.

[Joao Sapiro]

the winning pose is actually pretty good !

[indian_boy]

"he stared. This was his moment... what he'd been waiting for. After such a long struggle, he was now where he'd wanted to be. Holding his breath, he put forth his hand, and he clicketh upon the 'submit finals,' as the gods sang out in chorus: "dude pretty good!" The war had ended for Abhishek-opeles.... and now, Igliks was the one who'd have to prove his worth...."
and its all done

thanks u guys for the kindness. Glad u like the winning pose Johny, and thanks for the luck cridder, and glad for the encouragement rollin.

and my new thread has already begun:
Help me improve (http://boards.polycount.net/showflat.php?Cat=0&amp;Number=195437&amp;page=0&amp;vc=#Post19 5437)